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To keep the POLICE theme alive...my story from Monday Night....

Discussion in 'The Lounge' started by Done_rundleCams, Jun 6, 2006.

  1. Done_rundleCams

    Done_rundleCams AP Forum Ambassador to Canada

    I sent the following email (with photo -- at bottom) to several VPD sergeants I know a few hours after the incident ...... and have received one(1) reply so far (Tues June 6th @ 12:01) -- see reply below picture...
    .

    <span style="color:red"> The Scenario: At 21:49, after leaving the Royal Bank, I am walking (north) on Howe Street when I hear the sounds (like pepper/bear spray) and see two(2) males running through the parking lot towards Howe Street and look at where they came from and see a fellow lying on the ground of the west lane of 900 block Granville (along with someone who would have watched the entire event) so I phone 911 on my cell and see the two(2) fellows running westbound up Nelson street and then disappear out of my sight. I tell the 911 call-taker what I have witnessed including descriptions of the 'alleged' assault suspects along with what I think what happened and what I actually saw. I am told there is an officer on scene and would I go and make my presence known to him which I do and he proceeds to talk to a male and a female witness while waiting for an ambulance to arrive for the victim who is bleeding from the head and the officer doesn't really seem too interested in me so I take a photograph and then "everyone" is interested in me ....including the police officer who comes over and says: "because I take photographs of people's misery, he doesn't think I will make a credible witness" and I was the person to phone it in and give the descriptions (of the suspects) and location (of the victim) so he could find the place .....AND I won't make a 'credible witness' !!!!!!!!

    I should say if I had run over, taken pictures and then decided to call 911 after several (say5-8 minutes) even I would say I was 'immoral' photographer/person/witness and my 'credibility' as a witness might be slightened somewhat.

    **I am just curious as to your thoughts/comments on this situation**

    Cheers,

    Jack Simpson

    </span>






    The photo:

    [​IMG]


    The first (1st) response to my email: <span style="color:blue"> Hi Jack

    Do you happen to know who the officer is? Maybe I could have a friendly
    chat?

    Sgt. Keiron M (BGS, MSc)...two (2) degree's and working on his Doctorate :eek:
    </span>


    Cheers,

    Jack
     
  2. SiFowler

    SiFowler Well-Known Member

    I think the officer is an ass if he discounts witnesses for such a stupid reason.

    I like your photographs Jack- the way it shows it how it is, not how it should be or how some want us to think it is. I guess though that openly taking photographs of sensitive situations can leave you open to verbal attack (nothing more I hope). But having seen your photo's on here and listened to you over the years, I do not for one minute think of you as some ambulance chasing tog trying to get his kicks out of other peoples misery. The records you have taken over the years must surely give an insight into your city- one that has been glossed over by others.

    Keep up the good work Jack, and stay safe mate!
     
  3. downfader

    downfader Well-Known Member

    I agree with Simon. You've done a valiant act, helped the cop out big time and have even given them a direction (albeit small) to follow.

    From the year or so I've been on this forum I've come to see your photos as the real City Life. I see references to my home town, and I only wish I had your guts at times. You are one of the people who has inspired me to carry a camera as often as I physically can.

    Now if that cop could answer me this? If a jury were to see your photo, or the police records of the incident, what would sway their opinion more? Also what would offer a truer insight into what had happened to the guy? There again I hope he feels a little silly. He would have no say if it was a pro news tog.
     
  4. ElectricPics

    ElectricPics Well-Known Member

    I think you did the right thing. You're a human first, photographer second, so once you've helped as much as you were able, you get stuck in and get pictures. I occasionally get earache from cops but it just goes with the territory.
     
  5. Done_rundleCams

    Done_rundleCams AP Forum Ambassador to Canada

    Evening Simon,

    Thanks very much and, for the most part, have only had to endure verbal attacks and, ironically, had much the same words -- stay safe -- from one(1) of the sgt's to whom I sent my email, albeit last week :).

    Cheers and thanks again,

    Jack
     
  6. TH-Photos

    TH-Photos Well-Known Member

    I'm puzzled, not that it takes much after a 10hr shift, why didn't the officer apprehend at least one of the males running away? He must have been right there on the scene as it happened, and it was his pepperspray you heard. He's clearly carrying a sidearm, why did he not warn and then shoot one of the assailants? No wonder he doesn't think you are a credible witness, you would show up his mishandling of the situation in letting the thugs get away.

    As to the correct sequence of events in response to a situation my order would be:

    1. Report it,

    2. If no one else is there to offer assistance, then take a couple of grab shots to record the scene, and offer assistance.

    3. If assistance is being rendered, record as much as possible on film/memory card.
     
  7. Done_rundleCams

    Done_rundleCams AP Forum Ambassador to Canada

    Evening Dan,

    Once again, thanks very much and am glad to have inspired you to take your camera out with you and, as to
    I will be the first person to admit that, upon reflection or viewing pictures, I often wonder if I would have taken the shots had I given it more thought :eek: but, thank goodness, my gut/intuition is pretty good at sussing out situations :rolleyes:.

    Cheers and thanks again,

    :)

    Jack
     
  8. Done_rundleCams

    Done_rundleCams AP Forum Ambassador to Canada

    Evening Adrian,

    Thanks very much and, yeah, sometimes I think I should have earplugs for more than just shooting
    concerts :rolleyes:.

    Cheers,

    Jack
     
  9. Done_rundleCams

    Done_rundleCams AP Forum Ambassador to Canada

    Evening Ted,

    Ah, I see what has you puzzled and I should have made it more clear that Police Officer showed up, after I had my 911 call and the assailants had taken off so I think the only person at the scene (when I took the photo) who might have been a target for his sidearm......might have been me :eek: and, trust me, I have done some bad things but nothing, IMO, worthy of being shot over.....at least not by the police :rolleyes:.

    Cheers and thanks,

    :)

    Jack
     
  10. Bettina

    Bettina Well-Known Member

    Hi Jack,

    You haven't done anything to be sorry about. Carry on doing it! I would've done it this way myself.
     
  11. Done_rundleCams

    Done_rundleCams AP Forum Ambassador to Canada

    Very late evening Bettina,

    Thank very much mademoiselle :) ....much appreciated.

    Cheers,

    Jack
     
  12. jchrisc

    jchrisc Well-Known Member

    You got it right Jack and my impression is that you have enough real friends in the Vancouver Police not to be worried about this particular wally.

    Your incident makes my little spat fade into insignificance, but I wrote to the Chief Constable earlier and it will be interesting to see what, if any, response I get.

    Cheers Jack
     
  13. Done_rundleCams

    Done_rundleCams AP Forum Ambassador to Canada

    Morning Chris,

    I must admit to having, for the most part, a good relationship with the VPD :rolleyes: and I just received another (positive) response from Sgt. Keiron if I can dig up the initial officer's name or badge number ...which seems fair to me.

    Also, I would say that our 'incidents' are equal in significance ....it's just that mine included blood....and I am curious to see what the response is to your letter to the Chief of Police.

    Cheers and I am going to update my initial post with my second (and response) email and the response to that email .

    Jack
     
  14. Done_rundleCams

    Done_rundleCams AP Forum Ambassador to Canada

    To keep the police theme alive,my story from Monday Night (UPDATE1)

    My First (1st) Response... <span style="color:red"> Hi Keiron,

    Thanks for your reply but, unfortunately, I didn't get his name nor his
    badge number but the incident should be recorded. Truth be told, I was

    pretty steamed last night, hence the email which I as I reckoned would
    let
    off some of the steam and am feeling less hostile then last night and
    your
    postive reply is very much appreciated. It is rare for me to react
    this
    way and I usually find that writing/emailing people about the particular

    situation is generally a good catharsis.

    Cheers and, again, thanks very much for your much appreciated reply. </span>


    And his response to me... <span style="color:red"> Well if you happen to see them again...grab a pin and I will assist

    Keiron
    </span>

    and the saga continues.....

    Jack
     
  15. Repton

    Repton Well-Known Member

    Re: To keep the police theme alive,my story from Monday Night (UPDATE1)

    Interesting that thickness & incompetence straddles the globe!!

    Stay safe out there Jack
     
  16. T_Sargeant

    T_Sargeant Well-Known Member

    Re: To keep the police theme alive,my story from Monday Night (UPDATE1

    Sounds like you might have actually found an intelligent police officer on the end of that e-mail Jack! Sorry to hear about the earache you got, little minded people like that just get on my nerves. Also I'd like to second the sentiments expressed before, that your photos have been truly inspirational and I would never want you to stop doing what you do, I only wish I could come close to the level of skill and dedication you show.

    Thanks for the photos, looking forward to plenty more!
     
  17. Done_rundleCams

    Done_rundleCams AP Forum Ambassador to Canada

    Re: To keep the police theme alive,my story from Monday Night (UPDATE1)

    Morning Rep,

    yep, but seeminly more of a rarity across the pond....leastways, in Canada altough I think Toronto has probably tightened up a little more in the last couple of day :rolleyes:.

    Cheers and using as much common sense as is possib.....err a available.

    :)

    Jack
     
  18. Done_rundleCams

    Done_rundleCams AP Forum Ambassador to Canada

    Re: To keep the police theme alive,my story from Monday Night (UPDATE1

    Morning Tom,

    And the amazing thing is that this sgt is really physically intimidating (about 6'6" and 270 lbs) but a really educated (as well as smart....there is a difference :rolleyes:) and thanks very much for the kind words :eek:.

    Cheers,

    Jack
     
  19. FujiSigmaNolta

    FujiSigmaNolta Well-Known Member

    Hi Jack,

    Your story is just another blatant example of how ignorant the police force is everywhere, in what concerns the job of a photographer.Instead of acknowledging that what you are doing might actually help investigations and ask questions before saying anything,they seem to prefer mouthing such ignoranimus retardus maximus BS first. You are actually as a photographer in a good position to be a potential first witness to the incident.

    Anyway.......
    :D
     
  20. DaveCarr

    DaveCarr Well-Known Member

    Hiya Jack..

    Sorry to hear that you've been treated this way... I know I've only met you briefly, and ours has been but a internet "relationship" these last few years...

    ....but I'd bet my last dollar you would never maliciously take a picture.

    And in any case - you didn't!! Feel you have been poorly treated, and to be discounted as a credible witness, is frankly ridiculous IMHO.. You phoned 911, had a valuable account, descriptions...

    It makes me think back to London and 7/7, when - not much before - Ken the mayor of London was busy trying to ban photography everywhere, then (obviously) - the authorities where crying out for pictures - like Bettina's...

    Raw deal pal, keep shootin' - and be sure (and hopefully the response you got from your Police pals, plus that on here - a unanimous vote of support - shows...) that this particular officer <u>got it completely wrong</u>...

    ..and keep your eyes peeled too Jack - like has been said - "stay safe" old friend! and yep, I do admire your courage to shoot the pictures you do too..
     

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