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Smaller, lighter…

Discussion in 'The Lounge' started by GeoffR, Jul 15, 2021.

  1. GeoffR

    GeoffR Well-Known Member

    I have been thinking about ways to lighten the load. Many people recommended M4/3 as doing just that so, as an exercise I priced an Olympus kit.
    1.4x converter
    7-14 f2.8
    14-40 f2.8
    40-150 f2.8
    300 f4
    Around £4,500 used

    Two OM-D E-M1X or E-M1 Mk III bodies, with grips as appropriate, £3,000

    Total, £7,500! Back to the drawing board. I haven’t even bothered to see what the weight saving might be, any one have a better (cheaper) suggestion? Slower lenses and/or losing the grips aren’t options.
  2. Learning

    Learning Ethelred the Ill-Named

    How about getting the price of photographic equipment in perspective compared to a new car.
    New car, not bargain basement, not posh. £20,000.00.
    New camera system, not bargain basement, not posh. £10,000.00.
    Reduce both prices by going used.
    Also buying two identical cameras is not essential; it is a luxury. For many years I had a 'best' camera and something obsolete.
    Your lens choice is optimum. Most people would have to make compromises.
    If you want the best of your chosen type of system you have to pay for it.
  3. PeteRob

    PeteRob Well-Known Member

    I find that just taking one body and one lens out for the day and leaving the rest at home works well.

    My “light” kit if I want to carry a bag-full is 10-24, 18-55, 55-200 Fuji with an X-E2 (lightest) or X-H1 (heavier) bodies or both (heaviest). I haven’t put them on the scales but it all fits in a bag that’ll struggle to hold a Canon full frame with a single lens.

    I just (before lockdown) bought a X100V fixed lens compact. That’s quite light.
  4. GeoffR

    GeoffR Well-Known Member

    Having, for many years, extolled the virtues of having identical bodies I am not likely to change my view. If I were to change systems it would be even more important to avoid a steep learning curve. Learning to use one camera is time consuming, finding the controls means training the muscles and that requires practice. Learning two would take much longer.

    Let's not go into cars, I don't like the idea of paying a large part of the price in tax.

    You are right I have to pay the price for whichever system I might chose. With mirrorless there are fewer options for high end lenses simply because they haven't been around as long nor are they as established with the professionals.
    A practical suggestion, subverted by my wife's determination to take two and the fact that I really do find myself using both cameras almost every outing.

    Fortunately, my current system isn't a problem so I'll be sticking with that for a while longer.

    The really interesting finding is that smaller and lighter isn't necessarily cheaper, which I think we knew, neither is it significantly cheaper to buy a similar lens, used, for a smaller sensor than for full frame.
  5. Malcolm_Stewart

    Malcolm_Stewart Well-Known Member

    I know I'm not ticking enough of your boxes, but my current "go with me" camera is an Eos M5 (with built-in flash) fitted with its 18-55mm standard zoom. I have a wide range of Canon EF lenses, so I can use these if I want via the Canon EF to EF-M adapter. I'm still much more comfortable with my Canon 7D MkII and my recently purchased, 5Ds - almost identical to the 7D MkII in handling, viewfinder, GPS etc. Do you really need wide-aperture lenses in your wide-angle zooms?
  6. dangie

    dangie Senior Knobhead

    I think Geoff you’ve rather contradicted yourself. Ok you’ve chosen M4/3 for the smaller bodies & lenses, but you’ve probably chosen the heaviest bodies & lenses in the range.
  7. GeoffR

    GeoffR Well-Known Member

    There is only one wide angle zoom the 7-14 and there is no other option in the Olympus range with that range hence it would be f2.8 or f2.8
  8. GeoffR

    GeoffR Well-Known Member

    I tried one of the other bodies and found it too small, physically which rather excludes the E-M5 and E-M10, doesn't leave much does it.

    I think Fuji may be worthy of consideration. As I said, there is no rush and indeed it may never happen.
  9. Zou

    Zou Well-Known Member

    Maybe it would help to explain why you prefer to shoot with two bodies rather than one with a bag of lenses?
  10. GeoffR

    GeoffR Well-Known Member

    Tuesday this week, Watlington Hill, 70-200 plus TC17 for kites and butterflies, 24-70 for landscapes, how fast can you change a lens? Nothing like fast enough to capture a Red Kite while shooting the landscape I imagine. Most of the time I will be using the 24-70 but in areas where there are interesting birds, the need to transition from one to the other before said bird has flown necessitates the use of two bodies.
  11. Zou

    Zou Well-Known Member

    And do you have a set of custom preferences etc optimised for landscape and another for birds in flight? Or just leave bird body in appropriate AF/metering mode so ready to go?
  12. GeoffR

    GeoffR Well-Known Member

    The cameras have different AF settings in terms of focus mode, areas and lock on. If I were using one camera body it would take longer to change the settings than the lens but I would also need to think about the memory card/s. The body I use for birds etc. has a 64GB XQD card, giving a capacity of 1,600 shots, the other 32GB which is appropriate as I take multiple shots of birds etc. but singles of other subjects.
  13. Andrew Flannigan

    Andrew Flannigan Well-Known Member

    I long since realised that, with modern lens and sensor technology, I just don't need to drag a lot of kit around with me. If I really want to travel light, I put a Panasonic TZ70 in one pocket and a Sony HX90 in the other. There really is very little I can't tackle with them. Being something of a geat head, of course, I have several other kits to choose from but I'd be quite happy with just those two. :D

    Cameras Sony HX90 and Panasonic TZ70 DSC01601.JPG
    Trees against blue sky and cloud TZ70 TZ70 P1030518.JPG
    Friendly cat on wall TZ70 P1030492.JPG
    Pigeons kissing in silhouette TZ70 P1030357.JPG
    Jet airliner passing moon panorama DSC00517-19.jpg
    Blackbird maximum zoom Sony HX90 DSC00169.JPG
    ascu75 likes this.
  14. Footloose

    Footloose Well-Known Member

    I was thinking the same thing as Malcolm regarding the need for the faster f 2.8 7-14mm rather than the older f4 version with the adaptor. I have both of these, the f2.8 is significantly smaller, yet the optical quality is nigh-on the same. There's also the Lumix 7-14mm f2.8, which is much lighter and a bit smaller, but I gather images from it are a little 'soft'.

  15. Andrew Flannigan

    Andrew Flannigan Well-Known Member

    The Olympus 9-18mm weighs very little and does a good job...

    Commer utility vehicle with a Bedford crane in background Yorkshire Air Museum E-PL5 038010044.JPG
    Beverley Market Place E-PL5 P7310003.JPG
    Tree silhouette Exmouth E-PL5 P1290002.JPG
  16. GeoffR

    GeoffR Well-Known Member

    This is all a bit academic because I don't have £7,500 to spare for a new camera kit and I am not yet ready to trade in my Nikon system.

    My research, such as it was, was based on a like for like replacement of my existing lenses, sort of. I could remove, the 300 f4 as the 40-150 and converter comes out as a 450 equivalent. That brings the total down to £5,500. I am still unconvinced by the EVF and still wary of Olympus after the OM retreat, I was left with equipment that I couldn't use because the battery packs were discontinued.

    Of course the cost of the major hardware is only part of the overall cost of changing systems, software, accessories, batteries and spares have to be considered as well. Not forgetting memory cards. all in all a new system is a very expensive proposition, probably best left for another day.
  17. Chester AP

    Chester AP Well-Known Member

    It might be cheaper to hire somebody (younger and fitter?) to carry all your stuff when you go out on expeditions that require you to have all your kit available. Perhaps the question should be 'how much stuff do I have to have with me at all times?'

    Two or three years ago I checked the cost of an M4/3 lens that was the equivalent to my beloved old-model Sigma 10-20 (probably a Panasonic 7-14). Even second hand this Panasonic lens sells for c. £450, which is only slightly less than I paid for my Sigma 10-20 plus a Sigma 17-70 and a very nice Sigma 50 mm macro lens.

    Your £7,500 figure doesn't surprise me: it's an indication of the cost of those F 2.8 zoom lenses. Unfortunately, the smaller the sensor in the camera body, the more important large maximum lens apertures become due to diffraction effects at smaller apertures. I recall reading AP reviews suggesting that F 8 is the smallest aperture to use on M4/3 bodies, so if the maximum aperture is F 4.5 you won't have much choice of lens apertures when setting exposure.

    For the last 30 years my approach has been to buy the largest camera bag I'm prepared to carry and change the lenses in it depending on where I'm going, and that bag has been a Jessops £20 shoulder bag (or similar).

    In film days it contained the following:
    Pentax MX body with attached Tamron 28-200
    Pentax 50 mm F 1.7
    Vivitar 19 mm F 3.8 (very compact)
    Folding rubber lens hood for the 28-200
    Hand-held light meter
    Small blower brush
    3 or 4 rolls of Kodachrome

    After going digital it now contains the following:
    Pentax K-5 APS-C body with attached Sigma 17-70 (old model) OR a Tamron 18-250
    Sigma 10-20 (old model) with attached circular ND grad filter
    Folding rubber lens hood for the longer lenses
    Spare battery
    Small blower brush
    Spare memory card

    Any other lenses or a tripod only go if I'm travelling by car and know I won't have to carry them very far upon arrival, or for a specific subject locally. If I don't want to carry the bag, I usually just carry the camera body and attached Sigma 17-70 and folding rubber lens hood, and risk the 'I've never got the right lens' problem (which possibly results from the luxury of owning too many lenses anyway).
  18. IvorETower

    IvorETower Little Buttercup

    £7500 ??
    I think I should be contacted next time the mag runs a feature on bargain second-hand (or used) equipment.
    Last week I received a used E-M10 mark II with 14-42 EZ (pancake) lens with charger, no instructions , box or strap.
    I bought it from the website of one of the leading UK places that also has "real" bricks and mortar shops, advertised for £199-99 with third-party battery, a bit tatty in appearance.

    On arrival it may have had a non-OEM battery fitted, but in the charger was the original Olympus battery, dated from 2018.
    Ten minutes work with an old toothbrush and a few non-fragranced baby wipes had it looking almost as good as new.

    It's not necessary to buy all-new kit :)
    dangie and Andrew Flannigan like this.
  19. Andrew Flannigan

    Andrew Flannigan Well-Known Member

    Abso-bluidy-lutely! :D

    I've found that by buying second hand equipment and then selling it on, when no longer required, I've spent remarkably little cash on photography during the last 55 years. On several occassions, I've turned a very nice profit!
    Learning, ascu75 and zx9r like this.
  20. GeoffR

    GeoffR Well-Known Member

    That price of £7,500 is for USED equipment!

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