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Medium format film with modern tech

Discussion in 'Everything Film' started by MarcusT, Apr 20, 2016.

  1. MarcusT

    MarcusT Well-Known Member

    I am considering adopting my father's old twin lens Rollei for nostalgia's sake. What has been your experience in scanning newer 120 negatives? I have a Canonscann 9000F which is no slouch.
    Up to what size are they printable (min 200 ppi)?
    Thanks
     
  2. PeteRob

    PeteRob Well-Known Member

    Big. The resolution of film (and it varies with type) is a fundamental property of the medium. A large negative/positive such as 120 needs less enlargement than a 35 mm negative/positive to generate a given picture size. You adjust the scan resolution (ppi) according to how big you want to print it and how far you want to view it from so ratio of side of desired print to side of neg x 240 or 300. I'm away at the moment and can't remember how big commercial scans of my 120 negs were ( not used the camera for a while) I used to get scan to CD as jpg and 9"x9" enprints
     
  3. Zou

    Zou Well-Known Member

    A nominal 2.25" x 2.25" neg scanned at 4000dpi means a very large image. Have fun!
     
  4. Benchista

    Benchista Which Tyler

    As long as you have a reasonable scanner that can take the film and hold it flat, scanning 120 is much easier than 35mm in the sense that it's much more forgiving. Just before I bought my first DSLR, I was shooting quite a lot of 120 colour neg - Kodak Portra, mostly - and scanning it. Got some very nice A3 prints I did at the time with various cameras including some of my Rolleis - they would easily go much bigger.
     
  5. steveandthedogs

    steveandthedogs Well-Known Member

    I think the 9000f will only scan 2400 at 6x6, but at 200pixels/inch 79p/cm should give you somewhere around 67cm square.

    I think!

    S
     
  6. 0lybacker

    0lybacker In the Stop Bath

    Not done it myself but friend of mine who has used drum scanners professionally (Nikon Norman for those who like a source :rolleyes:) he reckons best films are Ektar 100, Ektar 100 and Ektar 100 with Kodak's discontinued 400CN as a runner up, both in 35mm and 120!

    However, have a look at Nick Moys' site: https://www.flickr.com/photos/grey_fish/

    I love Nick's stuff, he does great work! I suspect it is scanned from the neg but may not be. Why not contact him and ask? He tends to use tanning developers and slightly expensive ones but Oi vey! the quality!! :) Worth it.

    On scanning 120 with flat bed scanners, try dropping the neg, emulsion side down, straight onto a clean platten, cover with a sheet of very white, good quality, paper (by all means try photocopy paper but the ragging may show) and scan away. See what you get! Good luck.
     
    Last edited: Apr 20, 2016
  7. steveandthedogs

    steveandthedogs Well-Known Member

    You don't need to with the Canon, it has a 120 holder.

    S
     
  8. nimbus

    nimbus Well-Known Member

    Monos that are not coal and soot, makes a pleasant viewing experience.
     
  9. 0lybacker

    0lybacker In the Stop Bath

    Sure, Steve, but most scanners with film holders often struggle to hold the film flat. I believe the Canon 9000 is better than most in that regard. If you are in a hurry or happy to experiment, just drop the film on the platten & scan! Whole film, one go, no fiddling with holders. Cheers, Oly
     
    Benchista likes this.
  10. AlexMonro

    AlexMonro Old Grand Part Deux

    I'd agree with Oly's mate - Ektar 100 for colour scans.

    I have the 9000F MkII and it works well for me (with Vuescan software). Haven't had any trouble that I've noticed with negative flatness using the supplied holder, but I haven't tried printing bigger than 8x12". I usually only scan at 1200PPI otherwise it takes forever.
     
  11. MarcusT

    MarcusT Well-Known Member

    Thanks for the replies. I have scanned old, faded, damaged and curled med format negatives and it was a nightmare. I guess I'm looking forward to scanning new, fresh, flat negatives. Tried the ICE software and didn't care for it at all. It refers to hiding scratches dust and scratches by making the image so soft you can't make out faces.
    Not sure which way I'll go with the film as I don't have many traditional camera stores where I am. I'll probably order it through Amazon
     
  12. steveandthedogs

    steveandthedogs Well-Known Member

  13. MarcusT

    MarcusT Well-Known Member

  14. nimbus

    nimbus Well-Known Member

    That applies to most places these days.
     
  15. BungleBill

    BungleBill Active Member

    Having read through the posts a couple of questions arise.
    Would placing a negative directly on the platen make it out of focus given that negative holders hold negatives above the platen. I appreciate that items scanned by reflected light are placed directly on the platen.
    And do flat bed scanners record the full range of tones in a monochrome negative? If they do why bother with a purpose made film scanner?
    Jeff
     
  16. 0lybacker

    0lybacker In the Stop Bath

    Jeff, are the documents that you scan on the platten out of focus? You can set even cheapo flat beds to scan in different ways. Having wrestled with an Epson 1640OU for years I bought a s/h Canon Canoscan LiDE210 on eBay and am very pleased with it just on auto so far. Haven't messed around with m/f negs or trannies yet but may give it a try soon. It is claimed that the purpose made film holders provide better quality. If they do, they do it a premium price. ;) Cheers, Oly
     
    Last edited: Apr 20, 2016
  17. BungleBill

    BungleBill Active Member

    The reflected documents on the platen are fine. My elderly scanner has negative holders for films and they never seem as sharp as they should be. I suspect the film scans are slightly out of focus.
    Regarding mono. films I find it difficult to get decent scans from 35mm negs even when I under and over expose and use hdr to get the full range of tone. However acclaimed landscape photographers scan medium format film on high quality flat bed scanners to make huge files that print well.
    I have hundreds of 35mm slides and negatives that I would like to print digitally but can't afford a high end scanner to do the job and enlarger is long gone so I am still looking for an economical solution.
    Maybe the way forward is to photograph film using backlighting but my experiments so far are not wholly successfull."
    Jeff
     
  18. nimbus

    nimbus Well-Known Member

    A dedicated film scanner is I would consider the route that will produce the best results from 35mm originals. It partly depends as well on what size you want to print the results. I use a Nikon scanner purchased from Ebay, with a good original A3 prints are feasible from the scans from this machine. A film scanner can usually handle more contrasty images better than a flat bed.

    Photographing film is tricky, I have tried it, with mixed results. I used a Panagor Series VII slide duplicator screwed onto a macro lens, which means the material is held steady and in correct alignment and the macro lens is of much higher quality than the lenses in the usual T2 mount slide copying devices. I used flash as the light source as it is consistent in strength and colour temperature. I found the best results came from Kodachrome originals. I achieve better results with the Coolscan IV ED though.
     
  19. 0lybacker

    0lybacker In the Stop Bath

    Jeff, what do the instructions say? Do you not need to tell the software that you are using the film holder to shift the sensor's lens to a different position? That is really what you were driving at in your post @ #15. I never really used the Epson for film/tranny scanning - it was a struggle to use for flat copy* - but I recall that it had to be set-up for the job.

    You might also be interested in this method: http://www.japancamerahunter.com/2016/02/scanning-film-digital-camera/

    Cheers, Oly
    * Bought the 1640 in the days of Win98 & ME but I switched to WinXP after a Word glitch corrupted my PC. The Epson was always difficult with XP, at one point it would only talk to me in Italian! Think in the Canon 9000 that you have the best of the flat-beds.
     
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2016
  20. 0lybacker

    0lybacker In the Stop Bath

    hi nimbus, the OP is wanting to scan MF negatives, not 35mm. The only film scanners that will do that are high-end Minolta & Nikon and drum scanners, available second-hand, and - possibly - a new multi-format film scanner by one of the 'budget' manufacturers. Can't think when or where I heard about it but I have a notion there's something new available - at a price. Cheers, Oly
     

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