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Is it time to accept the unthinkable

Discussion in 'General Equipment Chat & Advice' started by pixelpuffin, Dec 25, 2019.

  1. pixelpuffin

    pixelpuffin Well-Known Member

    Funny you make a parallel using the multi tool
    I used to collect those - I was (a very) serious collector my username was and probably still is known in the worldwide multi tool scene - the expense dwarfed photography. I was never interested in the tools themselves (they are all just gimmicks) rather just the evolution and the very many different concepts bygone companies tried to create to avoid fringing patents on the major heavyweight names - sadly most have gone or licensed their brand names to eastern manufacturers. Hence the utter tripe that is churned out these days.

    But all this misty eyed reverence, I can’t help but wonder where you draw the line. How far do you take control until the image is finally yours and 100% of your own doing. If we want to be purists then technology should have no part be it phones, lightroom. auto iso, AP, TV, Program etc etc
    We have to strip it all back to the very core and then create with that if we want true ownership of the image anything less is contradictory.

    And that’s the real issue - we can’t stop progress....so we may as well embrace it.
  2. GeoffR

    GeoffR Well-Known Member

    Will it or are we limited by the laws of physics?

    More URG! Image processing is much easier with the right tools and one of those is a large screen. I have little doubt it will happen but I won't be buying either the camera or the phone. I quite often go out with a camera but without a phone the idea that I have to carry a phone doesn't appeal one bit.
  3. GeoffR

    GeoffR Well-Known Member

    Actually, they aren't just gimmicks, I have carried one for many years and the value is in that I can deal with the unexpected. Cutting threads from a frayed carpet one moment and resecuring a door seal the next, neither of which is why I was there in the first place. The proper tool is always to be preferred but carrying a Stanley knife in one's pocket is, rightly, frowned upon.
  4. pixelpuffin

    pixelpuffin Well-Known Member

    I’m completely opposite
    My iPhone lives in a wallet case
    Which holds both my debit card and often £20 note.
    That and my keys are with me every time I step out of the house - the phone is mostly in my pockets when in the house too.

    I view my phone as indispensable whereas my cameras have to justify if they are worth the hassle of dragging along
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2019
    NickM likes this.
  5. dream_police

    dream_police Well-Known Member

  6. pixelpuffin

    pixelpuffin Well-Known Member

    Sorry but I completely disagree
    My collection value is probably somewhere between £50-70k probably more now as prices are climbing at a ridiculous rate as new collectors with bigger deeper pockets emerge.
    Yet, there isn’t a single one I would take as EDC.
    At work I carry a folding boxcutter, a Stanley 6 way screwdriver sometimes I may carry a small pair of either grips or pliers.
    But never multitools. I have zero trust in them to deliver when needed and I’m certainly not going to sit and phaff playing when a proper tool can just as easily be carried and more importantly delivers.

    Each to their own.
  7. GeoffR

    GeoffR Well-Known Member

    I was at JNB at the time and I hadn't gone there to tidy up carpets but I was in the cabin and the carpet needed a trim so I used what I had. Most multi-tools I wouldn't give the time of day the Leatherman delivers, but possibly I am not terribly demanding.
  8. GeoffR

    GeoffR Well-Known Member

    I spent 54 years coping without a smart phone so I am pretty sure I can survive a couple of hours without one now.
  9. Andrew Flannigan

    Andrew Flannigan Well-Known Member

    You know what? When I were a lad we lived in hole in middle o' t' road! ;)
  10. dream_police

    dream_police Well-Known Member

    It's hard to imagine how some moved to digital. Bloody black magic, I tell thee. :)
    EightBitTony likes this.
  11. Andrew Flannigan

    Andrew Flannigan Well-Known Member

    It's science, init - not like that alchemy nonsense. I used to find it bluidy difficult holding the unicorn while I stirred the developer with its horn.
  12. John King

    John King In the Stop Bath

    As for DSLR's on the way out, given the metaphoric boot by the increasing use of smarphones is, can suggest that this is the equivalent of the point and shoot Instamatic or 110 cameras compared to 35mm film slr's I cannot disagree that the sheer convenience of phone cameras so that the users can send pictures instantly to their friends has an immense attraction. However they are not too good when it comes to taking a photograph of superb quality where long telephoto, or very wide angle lenses this will remain king for a very long time. I would not even consider using a phone camera for my serious work - the quality simply isn't there. Most have a limited method of recording the picture - usually a Jpg, whereas for the best available quality a RAW file will give greater quality and ability to be 'worked upon'.

    Add to that how many cameras in a phone are capable of lasting the number of frames used by say a press photographer (and many non professional users) No the death of the SLR is too early to announce.
  13. John King

    John King In the Stop Bath

    Lighter yes, anything to reduce the weight of my D700. The use of a good tripod will ensure that even a mediocre lens will show a dramatic improvement with a tripod but a lighter camera is just that bit more difficult to hold steady with a 70/300 lens unless a tripod is used. Vibration reduction lenses only service part of the problem
  14. dream_police

    dream_police Well-Known Member

    I have an App on my phone that produces RAW images. I could be wrong but I think some phones have that as a native product of their camera too.

    You are right though, there are some things which a phone cannot do and are no substitute for a DSLR/MFT and a good lens and a phone is unlikely to see them off, but there is a lot a phone camera can do.

    Perhaps it is a generational thing but I am never without my phone and therefore my camera and there have been many times I am glad I had it with me . I am mostly without my MFT or DSLR though and sometimes I choose not to be with one as I mentioned earlier.

    I am also one of those people that go out with a camera and look for photographs and come home with bugger all. If I am without it I see things and I have my phone with me!
  15. GeoffR

    GeoffR Well-Known Member

    A Z6 is 500g lighter than a D700 but whether it would be as easy to hand hold I couldn't say. I was more surprised to find that the D4 is only 245g heavier than a D700 the MB-D10 adds 400g so a D3 is actually lighter than a D700 with a grip. The D3 and D4 being almost the same weight (15g different).

    I was out this afternoon and saw only one other person carrying a camera, a bridge, everyone else was using a phone. It isn't hard to see how the phone replaced the compact camera, particularly as the camera is effectively a "free" addition to the phone. Whether the phone camera will displace the more specialist cameras remains to be seen but I would understand if those buyers who only choose an SLR and a standard zoom decided that a phone was a good substitute.

    I have to wonder what percentage of buyers never progress beyond the standard lens? Those are the people who appear to be the target for the new DX mirrorless from Nikon but might equally be the target for a multi lens phone. The only real market remaining for the specialist camera could soon be the long telephoto user.
  16. Chester AP

    Chester AP Well-Known Member

    By large I mean 50 x 75 cm (or more), and careful reading of AP's reviews of smartphones suggest that A4 is the realistic limit for prints from them. If this is as large as you want, and the smartphone does what you want, I wouldn't suggect you use a csamera instead. But I suspect that lots of decent images deserve to be seen on walls, but most of them are only ever displayed on smartphone screens. I suppose this is the modern version of the snapshot camera versus SLR debate of many decades ago.
  17. pixelpuffin

    pixelpuffin Well-Known Member

    ""I was out this afternoon and saw only one other person carrying a camera, a bridge, everyone else was using a phone. It isn't hard to see how the phone replaced the compact camera, particularly as the camera is effectively a "free" addition to the phone. Whether the phone camera will displace the more specialist cameras remains to be seen but I would understand if those buyers who only choose an SLR and a standard zoom decided that a phone was a good substitute.""

    Funny you mention that GeoffR
    When we were on our family hols a few months ago and indeed when we went to Belgium on a 2 day break back in July. The only dslr's I saw being carried and used were by women. Every single one. The men nearly all had smartphones and most were the latest generation, Xtra large size.
    Yes, I spotted that straight away and it made me chuckle as in past times, it would be men with dslr's and women with compacts.

    Role reversal one might say.
  18. nimbus

    nimbus Well-Known Member

    You might be surprised just how many women are into photography! Hey you even see them driving buses and taxis these days:).
    Geren, NickM and dream_police like this.
  19. MJB

    MJB Well-Known Member

    What! Before you know it they'll be wanting the right to vote.
  20. dream_police

    dream_police Well-Known Member

    And their own phones.
    Geren and EightBitTony like this.

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