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Exam Results

Discussion in 'The Lounge' started by MickLL, Aug 18, 2020.

  1. GeoffR

    GeoffR Well-Known Member

    There is most definitely an element of entitlement involved in those going to university, and the numbers involved certainly aren't helping in this respect, again blame Tony Blair for his 50% target. However TB isn't the only reason; all teachers are now graduates and it is fairly logical for them to recommend an academic path to their students, after all that is the route they took. They do this irrespective of whether it is the right route for the individual student. Thus the first question I must ask is this; is it appropriate that one must have a degree before becoming a teacher? Before answering that consider that many instructors in the workplace don't have degrees and may not even be qualified to teach, according to accepted wisdom. What these instructors do have is experience of the subject and a passion for getting it across, do all teachers have that? I might also add that many teachers have never lived outside the education system, I don't think that is good either.

    My next questions is related to that; would non-graduate teachers be more inclined to recommend a non-academic route to their students than would a graduate teacher? I think they might and that could be good for both universities and students because it might get the "right" students going to university. By right I mean those for whom it is the most appropriate route.

    I also feel impelled to ask whether accruing up to £60,000 of debt is the best start to working life we can offer the nations young people? I really don't think it is. Given that a huge number of graduates never get to pay back their student loans because there is no longer a premium for being a graduate in many fields, why do we persist in callin it a loan, in many cases it is a grant or a gift. The current corona virus situation has highlighted the inequity of a system in which a student may not get a refund on tuition fees if he/she gets no tuition.

    My opinion, as someone who doesn't have a university degree, is that we have too many universities offering too many degree courses in subjects of little academic and/or economic value. The whole education system seems to me to be dedicated to maintaining the education industry. Schools need to impart a combination of knowledge, enthusiasm and an ability to learn. The majority of those leaving school need to be able to get a job of some sort be it an apprenticeship, trainee scheme place or whatever and schools need to prepare their pupils for that eventuality. The minority, the very brightest, might be able to go to university and gain a degree that will prepare them for life outside education. I expect there to be some comment on that so I will add that there need to be routes that allow those who blossom academically late in life to get into university if they so desire.

    A final thought; the proliferation of degrees has the ultimate effects of reducing the value of a degree and devaluing those who don't have one. Neither is good for the individual or the country.
    Learning and Catriona like this.
  2. MickLL

    MickLL In the Stop Bath

    I see that GCSE results have jumped 9% based on teacher grades. Nuff said!!!! (except that's not quite as much as I would have guessed!)

  3. Stephen Rundle

    Stephen Rundle In the Stop Bath

    Actually the news is nothing but exams for four days getting really annoying
  4. MickLL

    MickLL In the Stop Bath

    It happens every year. This year is more interesting and is of National importance. You needn’t read it and it’s especially easy to ignore this thread.
  5. Petrochemist

    Petrochemist Well-Known Member

    There's still other news around if you look for it, Still plenty on Covid 19 after >6 months...

    In the meantime none of my kids have received their results yet (all 3 taking BTEC courses), so I'm rather hoping there is still some news on this to come!
    Learning and Catriona like this.
  6. GeoffR

    GeoffR Well-Known Member

    There was something yesterday to the effect that one body had pulled the BTec results but I have no more details.
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2020
  7. Scphoto

    Scphoto Well-Known Member

    It useful to hide all the Government corruption with handing out contracts to friends of Gove and Cummings.
  8. Learning

    Learning Ethelred the Ill-Named

    Suppose if the exams had taken place. This would still have been unfair to students without the facilities for distance learning. The results would reflect the achievements of students just as well or badly as examinations usually do. Over the years of criticism of exams, coursework became more relevant to the final grade. This favoured the hard working bright students over the really exceptionally clever students who coasted through classes while participating in lots of extra class activities. True or false it was often claimed that boys were penalised by this.
    Recently exams have become more important again. There are some creative subjects where course work clearly needs to be dominant. Exams, I feel, are good predictors of success in academic disciplines which are studied in universities. A levels were designed mainly for selecting University students. They were never any good for selecting entry to non-graduate employment.

    As to this years chaos. It was inevitable. There is no possible good outcome. It would not make much difference what government was in power. The same quasi government organisations would have faced the same unsolvable problems. Would Corbyn and his Momentum government have done better than Boris & Co.? I don't think so. Neither do I think that they would have done much worse.
    The challenge is to mitigate the damage.
  9. Malcolm_Stewart

    Malcolm_Stewart Well-Known Member

    And I can clearly remember a TV documentary decades ago when it was girls who weren't doing well at school. So something changed...
  10. Learning

    Learning Ethelred the Ill-Named

    Such as? You are a cynic. I know. It takes one one to know one.
    For real corruption in government you can't beat local government. I won't mention specific examples but refer you to the Rotten Boroughs column in any edition of Private Eye.
  11. Learning

    Learning Ethelred the Ill-Named

    The relative weight on exams and course work swings backwards and forwards. It needs to settle somewhere appropriate.
    What is appropriate one may ask. That's a bit too difficult for me but I suggest that the nature of the subject has to be taken into account. For example, you cannot expect school maths students to create cutting edge maths but you need to test if they have proficiency in maths under pressure and without recourse to reference. At the other extreme, you do expect fine art or photographic students to produce significant original work.
  12. SqueamishOssifrage

    SqueamishOssifrage Well-Known Member

    The very reason I cancelled my subscription to Private Eye. The Rotten Boroughs column used to make me so angry, I actually felt physically sick.
  13. MickLL

    MickLL In the Stop Bath

    I hear that A and A* grades are up by 25%. Anyone still believe that teachers get it right?

  14. dangie

    dangie Senior Knobhead

    Looks like we need to build more universities.
  15. MJB

    MJB Well-Known Member

    So what changed this year?
  16. Trannifan

    Trannifan Well-Known Member

    Aha....out of sight, out of mind?

  17. Catriona

    Catriona Well-Known Member

    Instead of some body making arbitrary cut offs for grading marks? Encouragement for children, increase in their own worth and who knows? Future high fliers?
  18. Petrochemist

    Petrochemist Well-Known Member

    Yes that's the level of encouragement my kids got from some or even most of their teachers this year.
    I think my 16 year old had reasonable contact from a couple of teachers, with on-line excercises from a few more. My other two (17 & 19) didn't hear a thing! Not that they've been overly bothered about that, being unable to meet friends was a much bigger concern. :(
  19. Geren

    Geren Well-Known Member

    We still have FE colleges. I work at one. We offer a range of courses from practical , vocational and academic. Plenty of choice.
    Andrew Flannigan and Catriona like this.
  20. Learning

    Learning Ethelred the Ill-Named

    Do we really need more graduates?

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