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D780 has landed

Discussion in 'Nikon Chat' started by AndyTake2, Jan 7, 2020.

  1. Barney

    Barney Well-Known Member

    The D780 list price is the same as the Z6 at launch.
     
  2. Learning

    Learning Ethelred the Ill-Named

    and far more mechanically complicated.
     
  3. GeoffR

    GeoffR Well-Known Member

    In 1996 the launch price of the F5 was £2,300 which illustrates how much of a bargain a modern DSLR actually represents. However, the differential between the D780 and the D850 strongly undermines the sales prospects of the former except where the prospective purchaser specifically wants the characteristics of the D780.

    I suspect many people will be making the comparison and seeing the D850 as the better long term buy, we shall see.
     
    Done_rundleCams likes this.
  4. IvorETower

    IvorETower Little Buttercup

    .... unless a D850 replacement is also due soon, in which case no doubt it too will have a heavy increase in price from the D850
     
  5. GeoffR

    GeoffR Well-Known Member

    Possibly, but that makes the D850 even more of a bargain.
     
  6. IvorETower

    IvorETower Little Buttercup

    I don't call £2500 for a camera a "bargain" !!
     
  7. GeoffR

    GeoffR Well-Known Member

    Compare what you get for £2,500 at 2020 values with what you got for £2,300 (F5) in 1996 and it is great value for money
     
  8. Learning

    Learning Ethelred the Ill-Named

    You seem to have no idea of he costs of the technology involved. I suppose that you consider £1469 too much for a new D500 to be also somewhat less than a bargain.
    Its machines like this that allow idiots like me make photographs. The D850 is a brilliant camera although not quite what I want. I prefer two D500 to one D850. Either way presently we are not being ripped off.
     
  9. John King

    John King Well-Known Member

    What is so important with a vertical grip? In close to 60 years using a camera I have never found the need for one. Extra weight. Extra bulk. Especially when the upper end cameras are so heavy now
     
  10. GeoffR

    GeoffR Well-Known Member

    Strangely, some of us find that extra bulk makes the camera much, much, more comfortable to use. The bigger battery lasts a lot longer (I did a, very cold, week in NY on two EN-EL18*s) and having an extra shutter release means the camera handling is near identical in either orientation. The balance with a long lens is also much better. However, for me the most important factor is that I don't have a finger hanging off the bottom of the camera, something that really irritates me. That is also why I keep saying that modern cameras, particularly mirrorless, are too small.

    We all have different ideas as to what is comfortable to hold but for me anything too small causes problems. At least with a camera like the D750 the grip is optional so if you don't want it you don't have to buy it.

    *I carried a D4 which has an integral grip but if I want greater resolution I have to move away from the top end cameras as even the D5 (too expensive) is only 20MP. Currently 24MP would be ideal and a camera without a built-in flash is attractive but without the option of a grip, I'll have to wait for the D850 prices to come down.
     
  11. AndyTake2

    AndyTake2 Well-Known Member

    As above - the option of a vertical grip makes a huge difference in the balance of a camera.
    When using heavier lenses, the extra mass balances things more evenly, and having somewhere to grip without having to worry about where the little finger is going helps a lot. Just as important, when shooting in portrait mode it is really useful to have that release. The default position for the release on a camera is top right, but that is in landscape mode. Switch to portrait and it prevents having to either stick the elbow out to the side, or put the hand in a weird position to tuck it in.

    The main gripe with the 780 is that it is NOT AN OPTION. Every other pro level camera has had one - from the D300 and D700 forwards. It isn't compulsory to have one - and many didn't bother, but if a vertical grip isn't important to pros - why is it built into the D3/4/5/6?
    Just Nikon trying to protect sales of the single digit cameras.

    Don't get me wrong - small cameras can be a good idea, but even using the Olympus OM10q I preferred the motor-drive attached a lot of the time. Not for the speed, just because it is a far better ergonomic fit. I think we all need an extra joint in the wrists in order to use portrait mode ergonomically :D
     
  12. Learning

    Learning Ethelred the Ill-Named

  13. ChrisNewman

    ChrisNewman Well-Known Member

    I have a D800, which I almost invariably use with a GPS sensor, that also functions as a wireless shutter release, connected to it. The D800, like Nikon’s other pro-spec DSLRs, has a 10-pin accessory terminal on the front. The D780 has its accessory terminal on the side. If you try to use a conventional “L” bracket to mount a camera on a tripod in portrait mode, anything plugged in to an accessory terminal on the side is likely to foul the tripod clamp. Positioning the terminal on the front avoids this problem. (I find the screw collar securing the 10-pin terminal fiddly to use, but that’s got little to do with its location). I came on this issue when looking at the possibility of switching to a Z7, which shares this issue, along with most of Nikon’s entry and mid-level cameras.

    Chris
     
    AndyTake2 likes this.
  14. GeoffR

    GeoffR Well-Known Member

    Nikon have managed to get some of the control layout common across the range but they seem to have managed to make enough small changes to make transition between models difficult. The absence of a 10 pin terminal is another black mark, professionals don't want two sets of accessories/cables and multiple different batteries. I can't see how this can be billed as a professional model but require a different battery from the D4/D5/D6 and D850 with grip, it makes no sense to me. Even with the adaptor plate for the MH26 having both EN-EL4 and EN-EL18 batteries is enough of an inconvenience, having to have the EN-EL15 and an additional charger to go with EN-EL18s and charger doesn't add up.

    I'm not a professional but I have travelled with cameras often enough to know that batteries and accessories in common across models makes life considerably easier. At one point I had a D1x and a D2H in Florida and I was charging EN-4 batteries every night. I now travel with two similar bodies and just two batteries. A D780 and a D4 would be going backwards.
     
    Last edited: Mar 11, 2020
    ChrisNewman likes this.
  15. IanG1957

    IanG1957 Well-Known Member

    I use a 'L' bracket on most of my cameras - very useful things - and the last I purchased (for the Z7) was by Smallrig (model 2258) - the interesting thing about this one is that the vertical part is mobile....and thus, with the turn of a screw, it can be moved closer to, or farther away from the lefthand connections on the camera body.

    I personally have little use for this possibility, but I imagine it to be useful if you do plug things in... 1255206016.jpg
     
  16. ChrisNewman

    ChrisNewman Well-Known Member

    Thanks for that, but I had found that extending brackets are available for the Z6/Z7. RRS make both a single-piece non-extending one and an extending one. Unsurprisingly the single piece one is half the weight of the extending one, and substantially cheaper, but I assume it’s more rigid. (I also noticed someone complaining on a forum that his Smallrig model 2258 bracket was too wide to fit his RRS Arca-Swiss compatible clamp - presumably yours fits the clamp you use OK!) If I do buy a Z7, I’ll be disappointed that I wouldn’t be able to mount it in portrait mode immediately above the clamp on a rigid one-piece 'L' bracket such as 3LT’s Zelda.

    I don’t know whether an equivalent extending 'L' bracket is available or planned for the D780.


    Chris
     
    IanG1957 likes this.
  17. IanG1957

    IanG1957 Well-Known Member

    I have a number of different ballheads and tripod clamps - and it works with them… (Manfrotto, Benro, no-name Chinese copies etc.)

    I feel sure they will! There's already one for the D850 - and that is like the 'Z' version, adjustable.
     
  18. ChrisNewman

    ChrisNewman Well-Known Member

    The only compatibility problem I’ve had with the Arca-Swiss system was a Neewer 100 mm long quick release plate I bought and returned because it was too narrow for the built-in clamp, and also the X-adapter, of my UniqBall UC45X tripod head to grip. Yet the Neewer universal “L” bracket I use on my D800, and a Neewer nodal rail I use to balance the weight of the camera and lens above the ball head, both fit well. So much for Neewer’s claim for their 100 mm plate that “Advanced CNC (Computerized Numeric Control) machine systems provide precise dimension to fit perfectly.”!

    (I use the Neewer universal “L” bracket on my D800, but being made of two castings screwed together, I doubt whether it’s as rigid as would be ideal. However, it’s biggest weakness is that the camera will sometimes swivel slightly on the friction grip of its rubber base. One advantage that the Z7, and I think the D780, have over my D800 are locating holes in the base, to take a locking pin on a matched quick release plate. The Neewer is the first “L” bracket I’ve used, I find it a great benefit, and I if I ever replace my D800, I intend to buy a good-quality matched “L” bracket for the new camera.)


    Chris
     
  19. IanG1957

    IanG1957 Well-Known Member

    Beware - this is true for some of the available L plates, but not all. I actually own three "Chinese" L plates for the Z series (my needs evolved, as did the designs of the plates) which are all engineered extremely well (sorry but I'm not spending RRS money JUST for the name…) and some have the locating lugs, others not - the 2258 for example, does, as does the 2232 for the D850 - no reason to think they'd change when they make one for the D780....;)
     
  20. GeoffR

    GeoffR Well-Known Member

    I have often wondered about L Brackets, what I have learned over the past few hours reinforces my opinion that I have absolutely no need of one, or two or three.
    Firstly they are of absolutely no use to anyone who doesn't use a tripod, I very rarely use a tripod and when I do it is with lenses that are fitted with tripod collars.
    Secondly, for my cameras they are very expensive, £250, about £65 more than a genuine battery.
    Thirdly, and finally, I really don't need the additional bulk.

    I can see the utility of such accessories for those who use tripods on a regular basis. I am also well aware that many of those who do consider my odd for not doing so. Tracking birds in flight when they are flying around and above one isn't the place to be encumbered with a tripod. I'll not be spending more on a bracket than I did on my most expensive tripod.

    In any case an L bracket is no substitute for a properly designed grip.
     

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