Discussion in 'AP Magazine Feedback & Suggestions' started by filmlover, Oct 17, 2011.
errr yeah. Your post to me!
no one said it wasn't a valid format.
We're ALL in agreement that it's still a valid medium, but it's you that is almost constantly unnecessarily hysterical on the topic - just re-read your own posts. I actually quite like the idea of some film-based articles myself, but the unpleasant way you've tried to treat posters who've not been in 100% agreement with you is just not acceptable, and I think many of us are heartily sick of it. The way you come over is that you imply that anyone that does not share your opinion can have no experience with film, and that they further have no value as a photographer. That may not be your intention, but it is the way it sounds. Please try to allow a little more respect for other people's opinions - we've all got respect for the fact that you want to continue to use film.
No I did not, I stated you appeared dismissive of film.
That rug really tied the room together
Don't look, there is no sense to this post
must be one of mine then....
Your own generalised opinion....I've made a perfectly reasonable request in my original post for AP to devote a few pages to film photography, therby giving the mag more balance......It is the somewhat hysterical reaction to this by some which has been surprising.
And I repeat...where have I accused people of being anti-film and where have I stated that film is better then digital? you seem to forget that I have also used digital, it's just that I happen to prefer film.
You should not attribute your own made up quotes to others, these are your own assumptions, not my quotes.
And who are these "We're all in agreement" people?....more assumptions by yourself?
As I've already stated, I'm quite happy with Mark from AP's reaction to my proposal, so I see no point in conitinuing with all this silly sniping.
We do love film and I think we all wish there was a bit more about, and certainly some new releases. The fact is though that there really are fewer people using it these days, but I'm glad to say AP has retained the majority of those still shooting the stuff.
As Mark says, we have a Portra 160 test in the 29th October issue, as well as a piece on shooting on photographic paper. Mr Kemplen writes about a film camera once a month, and Ivor covers a few. I know these are cameras and not film, but perhaps there's no so much to say about film these days - unless we think we could get the new people interested. Is that likely, do we think?
Like I said, re-read your posts, both in this thread and in fact ever since you've joined. You've constantly had a go at digital and denigrated anyone who disagreed with you since post 1.
I've not made up any quotes at all, what I've tried to point out to you is the way you come over. The correct response from you to my last post would've been "Oh, I see, sorry, that wasn't my intention" or words to that effect.
There wasn't a hysterical reaction to your proposal, it was you that was hysterical in your reaction to Fen (that I note you've still not had the decency to apologise for - bad form). Film v Digital is over as an argument - there just aren't people here who care what you use, it's entirely your own choice. How do I know we're all in agreement on that? Well I've been here 11 years and have been pretty active in that time - that doesn't make me special or clever, but it does mean I've got a pretty good idea of what the consensus is on here, and it's not remotely what you characterise. Yes, I know you've tried digital and prefer film - fine. I respect that, and I'm pretty sure (from my experience here) everyone else does. All we demand in return, and yes, I do mean demand, is that you give people who have a different preference the same respect. You've pushed it too far this time to be able to just drop the subject, you really will have to be a proper, respectful member of the forum or prepare for stormy waters. I very much hope you opt for the former, and share your experience with us - I think you've got loads of interesting stories and opinions to share, and I genuinely look forwards to hearing them, but please, please stop looking for a fight on this subject.
...although using Photoshop with wet fingers could be considered slightly dangerous
Damien, My impression is that there are new enthusiasts taking an interest in film. The current cheap prices of s/h quality film cameras and lenses gives would be film photographers in difficult financial times, the chance to get their hands on the kind of cameras that, in skilled hands, are capableof the finest results. Recent examples of s/h camera prices............
Olympus OM1n with 50mm 1.8 lens...excellent cond. £85. Nikon FM body nr. mint £95. ....I could go on.
As for film.....Agfa have re-introduced their 100asa "Precisa" film. ..Rollei have re-introduced both a 100asa b/w film and I believe a 400asa b/w one. available from Ag Photographic. When you couple this to Kodak's launch of the excellent 100asa Ektar film a couple of years ago, then there must be a resurgance of interest in film use for this to happen surely?
A respected Central London dealer mentioned to me recently that he couldn't get hold of enough Rolleiflexes, and Olympus OM4Ti's in decent condition to satisfy demand.....finally the successful existance of "Aperture" photographic and others in the Bloomsbury area surely confirms the demand for film products?
Where did I put that BIG RED button?
Stage left. Fen, push it NOW!
But the Group Art Editor ... respec' man! ... surely outranks the magazine Editor! You would, in any event, be quicker to the draw in a shootout!
I was, at the same time, both horrified at reading some of the nasty and or rude correspondence that flew between the pro and anti-digital brigades but also quite nostalgic as when a lot younger, I remembered photographers would get quite heated over whether B&W users were 'dinosaurs' and whether 35mm 'miniature' film could be a legitimate photographic film format - this in the mid-1970's!
Perhaps nimbus has got to him ... ?
Well if I misinterpreted Fen's post, then I'm happy to apologise, but I'm not apologising for being passionate about film. You still have a habit of "making up quotes" to suit your argument.
I notice that your original "We're all in agreement" quote, upon being challenged, has now been watered down to "I've got a pretty good idea what the concencus is"......and again you've still not stated whereabouts on this string I'm supposed to made accusations about "anti-film" and "film is better than digital".......
Made up quotes and "assumed opinions" do not add weight to your argument.
As I quoted earlier…
It still makes no sense but it does leave the floor open to anyone who wishes to submit a film, or digital, feature
And their B&W film in 100ISO, 35mm format. Currently a bargain at a well known purveyor of silver products at £20 - in effect - for ten!
Mike Walker is doing a steady trade, I understand, in 5x4s and similar, although I understand (modern) Gandolfi production is down to a one or three a year.
Aperture? You have to make allowances for Patrick's passion! There is quite a stock market (no, that's not a joke about glass cabinets in Aperture) in film cameras, with prices bouncing about quite a bit. Not quite the same for digital, I suspect, although I suspect there will always be plentiful demand for the high end DSLRs - eg. Canon 5Ds/5D M2s - and desirable compacts, etc. My only experience has been one or two forays to hunt for Nikon D70 bodies as possible B&W infra-red conversions: something that is more convenient in digital than film, in my view!
But there are one or two posting here who refuse to accept this 'evidence'. Funnily, immediately following their last posts to that effect, there have been some new threads about film cameras - someone buying a Yashica TLR, for example!
Well if you really can't tell the difference between me explaining the perceptions you create with "making up quotes" there's no hope for you. If I'm quoting you, it'll be in tag quotes or inverted commas, it won't be by saying "the way you come over is.." or similar phrases. Though why you're determined to believe it upsets people that you use film is something that's completely beyond me - the reason I say nobody cares is that there's precisely zero evidence to the contrary - do a search on here, read every thread if you wish, it's just not there. Be passionate about film, enjoy it, show us some of your pictures, have fun - just accept that not everybody thinks the same way, and they're just as right for themselves as you are for yourself.
Gunnery Sergeant Hartman, Full Metal Jacket
So there you have it, all laid out, plain and simple!
Ps. Hmm - I suspect Gunnery Sergeant Hartman would not approve of the PC nature of the swear filter, which is, apparently, racially bigoted!
Separate names with a comma.