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Why Do Courses Cost So Much?

Discussion in 'Talking Pictures' started by Lawsyd, Feb 6, 2017.

  1. Benchista

    Benchista Which Tyler

    £250 a day is absurdly cheap for a one-to-one session. £120 for a group session doesn't sound unreasonable, that's pretty much the price for any standard professional training anyway.
  2. Lawsyd

    Lawsyd Well-Known Member

    We didn't - it was all part of the service to the taxpayer. However, I can promise you that I worked every bit as hard at learning a new workshop (who the target audience were; 'tricky' bits in the workshop for either the trainer or students; where I could safely divert from 'the script'; etc) as I would expect any photographic workshop trainer to do.
  3. Lawsyd

    Lawsyd Well-Known Member

    The point that I was making in my OP was that those being trained aren't professionals (although, in time, some may go that way). Our hobby can cost a lot to even get started (several hundred pounds for the entry level model of most DSLR marques) so to then expect a hobbyist to pay £250 on top of that, for one day of training, I still feel is over the top.
  4. Roger Hicks

    Roger Hicks Well-Known Member

    Ah... So you had a steady job, paid (presumably) by the taxpayer.

    This is not quite the same as running photography classes as a business, and it is disingenuous (and perhaps a little arrogant) to pretend that it is.


  5. Roger Hicks

    Roger Hicks Well-Known Member

    The cost of training doesn't go down just because someone is an amateur. Why would it? Occasionally, at the expense of manufacturers, both my wife and I have taught both amateurs and professionals.

    It's a bit like saying that a hairdresser should charge an amateur photographer less for a haircut than they would charge a professional.


  6. RovingMike

    RovingMike Crucifixion's a doddle...

    My old golf pro used to say if more people spent more on lessons than on equipment, there'd be more good golfers about.

    I'm sure it applies to photography too.
  7. PeteRob

    PeteRob Well-Known Member

    I don't understand where "expect to pay" comes from. That is the price and the customer can decide if they want the training or not. I took a training course (one-to-one) because I wanted some information that I could not otherwise get. It cost rather more than the above courses but was very much worth it.
    Roger Hicks likes this.
  8. Roger Hicks

    Roger Hicks Well-Known Member

    Dear Pete,

    And, of course, the trainer/ instructor/ course leader can decide what he or she needs to be paid in order to make the whole thing financially viable. This is not a question of "expectation" on anyone's part. It's a question of cold calculation. The more so when you're not on a salary so that you get paid with or without running courses.


  9. MJB

    MJB Well-Known Member

    Is it? Similar prices will get you a days tuition/training with an AAPGAI qualified fly-fishing instructor or a PGA qualified golf pro (of course they probably know sod all about photography, so don't use them for photography tuition.).
    Lawsyd likes this.
  10. Benchista

    Benchista Which Tyler

    Then I'm afraid your expectations are plain crazy. Presumably you expect the trainer to be professional? I would say that is about half of the bottom-end price you should expect, to be honest, for a full day.
    Roger Hicks likes this.
  11. Maroon

    Maroon Well-Known Member

    As a hobbyist you will always feel it is expensive as you don't see it as training that will hopefully end in a higher quality of work and in turn a higher income.

    Most training courses are aimed at those looking to expand their career and so will be priced towards that.
    Roger Hicks likes this.
  12. Lawsyd

    Lawsyd Well-Known Member

    1) Ah, the old 'private sector bad - public sector good' argument. As wrong today as it ever was - if only because there are good and bad trainers in both sectors.
    2) Whilst I don't have to justify my career to you I can, nevertheless, assure you that I was as professional in my approach to the training I delivered as any other trainer delivering to the private sector.

    And you are correct, the taxpayer did pay my wages. Just think how rich I would have been had I been able to charge the ridiculous (in my opinion) fees charged by the private sector.
    Andrew Flannigan likes this.
  13. Benchista

    Benchista Which Tyler

    You're completely misunderstanding Roger's argument. It's not a good/bad argument, it's a steady income/uncertainty argument.
    Roger Hicks and RogerMac like this.
  14. Lawsyd

    Lawsyd Well-Known Member

    OK folks, I'm making an early request, if I may. Is it possible to end this thread now? I started off with a genuinely held belief. The overwhelming majority on here feel my view is incorrect (I've no problem with that - Mrs Lawsyd reminds me how wrong I am on a daily basis!!). However, the thread is turning into a Tw***er type spat, in places, & I really don't want that - if only because I may require the help or guidance of any or all of you at some future date. So, as I've asked, can we end this thread here please?
    Gezza likes this.
  15. spinno

    spinno Well-Known Member

    To finish I am surprised that nobody mentioned the one skill that the vast majority of us have that needed expert tuition...driving lessons.
  16. PeteRob

    PeteRob Well-Known Member

    Driving is quite high on the risk scale. At work some years ago it was decided, as a risk reduction measure, that one could not drive on business (hire car or company car) without passing the IAM test. Company paid for the defensive driving training, membership of IAM (for the one year) and the test. The "currency" was I think 3 years. I definitely went through this cycle 4 times - it may have been more. Well worth it. The scheme was eventually discontinued, I think due to a general reduction in company mileage amongst my peer group and company cars being replaced by car allowances. Speeding, being unfit to drive, not wearing a seatbelt and using a cell-phone while driving were made violations of terms of employment, which is a less expensive route to a similar goal.

    I was astounded at a letter published in The Sunday Times Driving a couple of weeks ago. It was someone writing to say that they had been on a driver safety awareness course and could someone tell them how to get a sat nav to raise an alert whenever they were exceeding the speed limit. Somewhat indicating that the "awareness" bit of the lesson had completely passed them by.
    Andrew Flannigan and Roger Hicks like this.
  17. Roger Hicks

    Roger Hicks Well-Known Member

    Nonsense. You're changing your grounds for the argument because you're simply wrong. Few are greater advocates of the public sector than I. This does not mean that I have to accept your specious special pleading. By the same token, your request to close the thread is an admission of defeat.


  18. lisadb

    lisadb Well-Known Member

    I've been on a few 3 or 5 day photos holidays/courses and thoroughly enjoyed them. And while not cheap, I don't think I could stay cheerful and patient with a group of 5 strangers from 5am to 10pm for several days ! :eek:
    Roger Hicks likes this.
  19. Roger Hicks

    Roger Hicks Well-Known Member

    A further thought on this. Most of us here will be more than willing to extend help or guidance if you genuinely need it. This thread should not affect this. On the other hand, quite a lot of us do not take kindly to someone who has not the faintest idea of what he is talking about; pretends he does; and then refuses to admit the fact. Ask a question: any genuine question. We will do our best. to help. Try us and see!


    RogerMac, lisadb and Andrew Flannigan like this.
  20. P_Stoddart

    P_Stoddart Well-Known Member

    Well don't sweat too much Lawsyd LOL

    but I cannot agree with your statement as well of

    "Our hobby can cost a lot to even get started (several hundred pounds for the entry level model of most DSLR marques) so to then expect a hobbyist to pay £250 on top of that, for one day of training, I still feel is over the top."

    See photography is really not about kit, that is not a myth :)

    The myth is a shooter needing a dSLR to take great pics. LOL

    Photography is about understanding light, composition, spotting sets of elements that work and create possibly emotions in viewer.

    That can be done on a secondhand compact LOL Even a smartphone LOL Hey even a bake bean tin (seen a exhibition of such work) LOL

    I talk from experience and I bet there are quite few on here that will have similar stories.

    I won over judges at my photography society along side images taken with £1000s of high kit, alot of them dSLRs.:p LOL

    So even you feel course are too much join a camera club make friend and talk to experienced shooters and get the insight for free or very little. Plus have fun as well. You will get seasoned shooters judging your work and if they like it maybe you are then on the right track in your photography journey. But above all ENJOY your hobby take photos YOU like that MAKE happy.

    Once you understand the effect of f stop, shutter speed, focal length etc (boring stuff LOL) You can the use those levels on the image to create art YOU like.

    Hell you can use a seach engine or look at a video online that will tell you what happens when fiddle with the f stop etc.

    AP even have free seminar at Blue Fin where experience shooters tell you their take on making art.

    If you having a real problem with understand how to fly your kit then ask us that is what the forum for. Someone on here might have the answer or point you to a killer video which shows the xyz on your kit. LOL

    Anyway as I said at the beginning don't sweat it, its a hobby for fun. Unless your goal is to turn it a profession. :) ie make cash LOL
    Maroon, Petrochemist and Lawsyd like this.

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