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What would make compact system cameras more attractive to you?

Discussion in 'Weekly Poll' started by Damien_Demolder, Jun 6, 2011.

  1. Graham_RM13

    Graham_RM13 Well-Known Member

    Re: What would make compact system cameras more attractive to yo

    I would really like to be able to customise the info. in the EVF, to have it display what I want and display it where I want it. Why should the info always be fixed in "landscape" mode, I shoot a lot of portraits and having the info along the bottom would be far more useful. Many systems have orientation sensors, so why not flip the viewfinder info display. Having it fully customisable would give "My Mode" real meaning.

    With all the adapters that are available for these things, fast primes from past times are great fun to play with and can produce some wonderfully differentially focused images.

    In some ways they are like the hot hatch crossover is to the Chelsea Tractor...
     
  2. Learning

    Learning Ethelred the Ill-Named

    Re: What would make compact system cameras more attractive to yo

    That requirement is a trivial firmware option. Any manufacturer that doesn't realise that deserves to go bust.
     
  3. Guitarist

    Guitarist Well-Known Member

    Re: What would make compact system cameras more attractive to yo

    I don't need a CSC. I have a Canon G11 which does all I want a compact camera to do and more, and it is fitted with an optical viewfinder. Some say that this viewfinder is inaccurate, but it isn't when you get used to it and make allowances. This supplements my Nikon D90 outfit very nicely, and of course puts my feet in both major photographic camps!
     
  4. Barney

    Barney Well-Known Member

    Re: What would make compact system cameras more attractive to yo

    For those already with DSLR systems I think the key word is supplements. Although I have an adaptor to use my Nikon lenses on my GF1 I never bother with it. I don't feel the need to go out and buy any dedicated lenses for it either. I suspect that this comes from a maturity and assuredness in my photography that I know the strengths of each system and am content to withstand the drawbacks.

    I've just come back from a short break in Dumries and Galloway. I'd took along both my D3 and my GF1. I also packed my tripod as holdiays seem to be the only time I get around to chasing some golden hour light and shoot landscape stuff. I managed one evening out with my D3, tripod & filters and spent a pleasant enough evening waiting for light that never came and came home empty handed. The following evening, we strolled down to the local pub for dinner and I captured a very pleasing (to me anyway) landscape with the GF1, handheld.

    As the truism goes, the best camera is the one you have with you, and because the GF1 is so compact I always have a good camera with me. It's not always the right camera, so I still miss shots, but they tend to be shots I wouldn't have got anyway because I wouldn't have had the right kit with me in the first place.
     
  5. Atavar

    Atavar Well-Known Member

    Re: What would make compact system cameras more attractive to yo

    I'd love a digi Nikon FM2 (Yes, there's always one) with the ISO capabilities of the D7000 or better. It would be much smaller and thinner than the SLR digiboxes kicking about, but still with a mirrored optical viewfinder and capable of taking all my current lenses which would mean not having to set up a new lens manufacture system. Bring back the Tessar lenses like very good on DX sensor 45mm f2.8 P and that'd be a very compact little system indeed.
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2011
  6. Barney

    Barney Well-Known Member

    Re: What would make compact system cameras more attractive to yo

    Why didn't you just say that you want a FujiFilm X100 with an F-Mount? :D

    It might come, but I doubt with the optical finder which I suspect will remain a preserve of the fixed lens system, mainy due to the fact that EVFs will improve dramatically over the next few years.

    I see a few issues with reviving the Nikkor 45mm f/2.8 P.

    Firstly it's a manual focus lens so it wouldn't require a revival but a complete redesign from the ground up.

    Secondly, you'd still need to maintain the right distance to the film plane/sensor. I have one which I can use on my GF1 with an adaptor, but combined the lens and adaptor is larger than my Nikkor 50/1.4. Sure it will work on a larger body maintaining the same distance to the sensor plane as a DSLR, but then you lose the advantage of CCS allowing smaller bodies.

    Finally, it's still only f/2.8. AP report the launch of a new Leica-branded 25mm f/1.4 Micro Four Thirds lens which will compliment the existing 20/1.7 pancake, which are both faster and offer a similar field of view to the 45mm on a full frame sensor, or a more useful one than the 67.5mm you'd get on a cropped Nikon sensor.

    I have an extensive Nikon DSLR system, but I have no desire to have a CCS with an F mount. Both systems do such different jobs for me, and only my Nikkor 50/1.4 would anything like balanced on a smaller body.

    Instead, and being realistic, I'd like FujiFilm to add a couple more fixed lens cameras to their range. One for the landscape fans so a 16mm lens (equiv 24mm) or thereabouts, and one for portrait fans, so a short telephoto length, say 60mm (equiv 90mm). I'd then be hankering over the current X100 and the portrait body and not able to afford either one.
     
  7. GeoffR

    GeoffR Well-Known Member

    Re: What would make compact system cameras more attractive to yo

    Fundamentally, nothing about Compact System Cameras appeals to me at the moment. To make them more attractive they would have to be completely redesigned.
    I would want a hand sized grip, a decent sized battery and some form of optical view finder. That isn't going to make for a "compact" camera and wouldn't be very popular with those who value convenience over quality so it won't happen, and I won't be buying what is currently being offered.
     
  8. Atavar

    Atavar Well-Known Member

    Re: What would make compact system cameras more attractive to yo

    Ah, a fair appraisal. I'll have to accept its a new market, not a return to an old one.
     
  9. APchris

    APchris Well-Known Member

    Re: What would make compact system cameras more attractive to yo

    I also would have said an optical viewfinder is a must... indeed, if you look at my compact purchases - Olympus C3030, Casio EX-P600 and Sony DSC-V1 - it's clear an optical viewfinder has been high on my requirements list in the past. But looking back, I have rarely used the optical finders.

    So now I'm looking to buy my next camera, a CSC is the obvious choice for its compact size and DSLR image quality. The ability to change lenses is a bonus. A viewfinder - optical or EVF - is now very low on the list. Indeed, I'll go as far as saying it virtually rules out a particular model because of the extra bulk it adds that I now know I won't use.

    I arrived too late for the poll so I've no idea what the options were but to answer Damian's question... I'd like a Sony NEX-5 with the external controls of the Panasonic GF1 and a kit lens like the Olympus 14-42 M.Zuiko f/3.5-5.6.
     
  10. Antony_Shepherd

    Antony_Shepherd Active Member

    Re: What would make compact system cameras more attractive to yo

    I think the problem now with these cameras is that as the cameras get smaller, the lenses stay the same size, which makes them look completely out of proportion with the camera.

    Look at the lenses Pentax produced for their Auto 110, for example. It is, I believe, possible to use these lenses on a micro-four-thirds camera, although you need an adaptor that can take little slot-in apertures or shoot wide open, as the Auto 110 had its aperture mechanism in the camera body.

    Ok, so autofocus and anti-shake mechanisms bulk out lenses more, but perhaps with some lateral thinking someone could produce lenses that would be smaller than the current crop and more suited to the camera's own small size.
     
  11. Nod

    Nod Well-Known Member

    Re: What would make compact system cameras more attractive to yo

    but drink like Vikings

    I've just come back from a holiday on an island (Crete) that is also densely touristed by Both Danes and Norwegians and I resent any implication that I drink like either nationality - I don';t touch a drop before 6 o'clock while they seem happy to consider a Mojito suitable as the fruit juice with their breakfast! Some even have an Irish coffee with it rather than a latte or cappuchino.
     
  12. Damien_Demolder

    Damien_Demolder Well-Known Member

    Re: What would make compact system cameras more attractive to yo

    I've asked. In fact I asked about five years ago. And do you know, they laughed! Laughed. Can you believe it? They will though. Not yet, but it won't be too long.

    I'm quite in love with compact system cameras, though I can see their shortcomings too. The styling and operation of the Pen and Lumix models is great, and the picture quality is great in bright conditions. The Sonys are very slim and easy to carry, but (and I know you all think its some crap cheap Korean brand) the Samsung NX bodies do it for me. I like the picture quality and the DSLR-style handling. The rear screens lack enough resolution for manually focusing my Nikkor lenses in low light, but they'll get over that next time I hope. An NX100 with a 30mm pancake makes a great street camera - even at ISO 1600.
     
  13. Zou

    Zou Well-Known Member

    Re: What would make compact system cameras more attractive to yo

    I have been very underwhelmed with the NX10/11 which I have handled in store. The EVF is awful. IQ does seem alright, but the next generation this summer should see a modern sensor which will move it ahead hugely. For this body type the Lumix G is streets ahead in handling for me.

    Biggest issue? No-one seems to list their lenses. THe NX100 at £300 with the small (although odd focal length) zoom seems an absolute steal, but finding someone with the 30mm pancake or even any non-kit lens has been an issue. I won't buy 'unseen.'

    Quite keen to see what the NX200 is like, especially if (as rumoured) it has a 18MP sensor. That's a serious proposition in such a compact body. Get it right and get a good EVF (ie at least on a par with Olympus' VF2) and I might just be tempted.
     
  14. P_Stoddart

    P_Stoddart Well-Known Member

    Re: What would make compact system cameras more attractive to yo

    The DxOmark noise figure does not look good considering it is a APS sensor.
     
  15. Zou

    Zou Well-Known Member

    Re: What would make compact system cameras more attractive to yo

    Meanwhile back in the real world it's actually not awful. DxO has its place but it should never replace proper trials.
     
  16. Benchista

    Benchista Which Tyler

    Re: What would make compact system cameras more attractive to yo

    Undoubtedly, but DxOMark doesn't.
     
  17. Zou

    Zou Well-Known Member

    Re: What would make compact system cameras more attractive to yo

    I'm sure you know that's what I meant... ;)
     
  18. Benchista

    Benchista Which Tyler

    Re: What would make compact system cameras more attractive to yo

    Yes, and I forgot the smiley...:rolleyes:
     
  19. Barney

    Barney Well-Known Member

    Re: What would make compact system cameras more attractive to yo

    Oh I don't know, it's worthy of a place in the bin, Shirley?:D
     
  20. 0lybacker

    0lybacker In the Stop Bath

    Re: What would make compact system cameras more attractive to yo

    Compact, RAW capability, 28-100mm-ish (35mm equiv) zoom, as big a sensor as possible, as few pixels as possible (12 to 12 Mp) AND AN OPTICAL ZOOM VIEWFINDER COVERING THE STANDARD ZOOM BUILT IN!

    Oh, and preferably carrying the name of Olympus or Nikon. ;-)
     

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