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Wasted adverts and mad uncles

Discussion in 'AP Magazine Feedback & Suggestions' started by TheSeeingEye, Jul 21, 2015.

  1. TheSeeingEye

    TheSeeingEye Active Member

    Do the (paying) advertisers in AP realise their efforts are wasted when they (try to) cram so much into a single page? For several years now (and I am well under 60 years) I have read many of these adverts with a large magnifying glass to actually read whats there. Even my young wife cannot see it!

    What a waste, in most cases I ignore the adverts and go online to buy as at least I can see the text.

    Have those laying out the magazines not read health and safety codes nevermind plain legibility?

    While I am in rant mode what about Mad Roger's page at the rear of the magazine. Like an old mad uncle he (continuously) churns out a load of drivel. Occasionally (in his lucid moments?) there is some sense there.
  2. Terrywoodenpic

    Terrywoodenpic Well-Known Member

    That is why we have large magnifying glasses....

    As for mad uncles...what would we do without them.....
    The one in question is not so much mad as very well read and very knowledgeable. At the very least he gives us cause to think, rather than drown in mediocrity.
    Even if some of what he writes goes over the heads of some, at the very least it is always entertaining and educational.
  3. gray1720

    gray1720 Well-Known Member

    So why do you bother coming here if all you are going to do is rant about the magazine? The last thread you started was at least as long and considerably less interesting than anything Roger has written.

  4. Sejanus.Aelianus

    Sejanus.Aelianus In the Stop Bath

    That's one opinion, others are available.

  5. PhotoEcosse

    PhotoEcosse Well-Known Member

    Yes - I would have preferred "entertaining or educational". Not always both simultaneously.

    Why do I say that? Because, to me, the word "entertaining" has to include an element of enjoyment. Sometimes Roger makes points that I find thought-provoking but uncomfortable. I would classify any such as educational (because I inevitably learn something new - even if it is only a new way to think about something) but not necessarily entertaining.

    With regard to the typeface size in display advertising, the smallest I could find in the current issue was that for Collectable Cameras on p74 and sometimes there is a similar size used in adverts for a Mr Cad. Ffordes and Mifsuds use a slightly larger face. I have no difficulty reading any of them (I use varifocal spectacles to correct my septuagenarian eyesight) and would suggest that perhaps TheSeethingEye might benefit from a trip to his optician.

    But advertisers pay money to make money. Presumably the balance they find between volume of lineage and typeface size is the balance they find works best from their commercial perspective.

    This discussion reminds me of an issue about AP that I have aired before but, rather than hijack this thread, I'll go and start another.

  6. Roger Hicks

    Roger Hicks Well-Known Member

    Dear Eric,

    Thanks: I'm doing something right then. I'll cheerfully accept "entertaining or educational" because that's what I try to do. Of course I aim for both, but if I get only the latter, it's a good start. As long as there's enough entertainment in the column that most people will put up with me most of the time, I think it's probably better to make people think than merely to entertain them. Otherwise, my job would merely be confirming the prejudices of those who don't like to think; of whom there are distressingly many.


  7. Sejanus.Aelianus

    Sejanus.Aelianus In the Stop Bath

    What drives you to randomly insult people who may be your readers and therefor contribute to your income?

    Again, how do you know that there is anyone who doesn't like to think? What statistics can you quote to back up that assertion?
  8. PhotoEcosse

    PhotoEcosse Well-Known Member


    Bold bit - are you sure it is random? I think I detect a reasonably clear degree of selection. In my opinion.

    Italicky bit - Assertions can be backed up by non-statistical evidence. This forum is full of such evidence but I don't think it is reasonable to expect anyone to go back and count occurrences in order to give a statistical analysis. Again, in my opinion.

  9. Roger Hicks

    Roger Hicks Well-Known Member

    Dear Eric,

    Your perception accords with my intention. Para 1: I consider it poor form to insult anyone accidentally or randomly. In fact I try not to insult people at all, but if they are upset by my opinion; take what I have said personally; and regard it as an insult; well, I'm not going to stop presenting what I regard as honest and reasoned opinions. In general, on the forum, it's easier to put 'em on ignore. Para 2: precisely.

    To quote Nigel Atheron, our Beloved Helmsman, Chairman and Leader, "You do realize you're a Marmite columnist? That people either love you or hate you?" It would be a very boring magazine if everything were so bland that everyone agreed all the time (or always had their prejudices confirmed).

    Actually, I'm fairly indifferent to Marmite. It's OK, especially on bread with plenty of butter, but I neither loathe it not love it. I am reasonably confident that plenty are indifferent to me too. But I always liked Garry Coward-Williams's description of my job: "to rattle their cages".


  10. Terrywoodenpic

    Terrywoodenpic Well-Known Member

    Now, that is a statement you have used on another thread today, complete with smiley.

    No doubt you will now give those other available opinions..............
  11. TheSeeingEye

    TheSeeingEye Active Member

    I definitely owe you an apology as I stated your column as drivel when what I should have said is occasionally drivel (pressures of press deadlines?). That is the problem with a rant there can be collateral damage. I must be more considered and considerate as I am at heart a 'troll' or agent provocateur? However this is the forum for magazine feedback so there it is.

    Certainly there is some content I enjoy, for example the deceased Victorian Plymouth commercial Photographer you slagged off (without him being able to defend himself) as his is local to me so of some interest. Other column inches I often vehemently disagree with and think to myself how detached you are from amateur photographers of today (including myself with only 44 years in photography). There are them that do and those that write about it (or teach)?

    Nonetheless you have had a good run. Even your response in here is full of words slightly obscure and esoteric to the point of petulance. Mad uncle indeed but don't we all love and value mad uncles? The mad uncle jibe was intended in an affectionate way. Paying for their self-indulgence though is another question and as another respondent wrote 'there are alternative opinions'.

    "... if the cap fits, wear it...."
  12. Roger Hicks

    Roger Hicks Well-Known Member

    Thanks for your apology, which is gladly accepted, but there are still a few points I think I might address. I try not to write drivel, and I think I succeed quite often. Are you perhaps conflating three things: drivel, stuff you don't agree with and even sometimes things you can't understand?

    "Slagged off" the chap in Plymouth? Not really. I said that it didn't look like a very good picture, principally because of the Toulouse-Lautrec legs, but then I speculated on why he might have shot it that way: Victorians were often great symbolists, and we do not always understand their symbolism today.

    "There are them that do and those that write about it (or teach)". And them as has exhibitions at Arles and are well known internationally, as compared with them as sits on the sidelines and snipes without even being brave enough to use their real names. Perhaps you'd care to reveal to us who you are and what you "do".

    "Even your response in here is full of words slightly obscure and esoteric to the point of petulance", Eh? I'm not writing in a controlled vocabulary for the benefit of children who don't read so good. Rather, I assume that my readers are reasonably literate. Which words have you in mind? And what "self-indulgence"?


    Last edited: Jul 21, 2015
  13. Sejanus.Aelianus

    Sejanus.Aelianus In the Stop Bath

    Roger, it's entirely obvious you don't ignore those of us you claim to ignore. Still, there is some amusement to be gained from watching the way you try to steer threads so that you can deliver yet another snipe at those you are "ignoring".

    Carry on.

  14. Malcolm_Stewart

    Malcolm_Stewart Well-Known Member

    Does the OP use spectacles?, and if so, when did (s)he have an eye test which checked out near vision. I have no difficulty reading the small print in the adverts using my bifocals - but I order on-line to ensure that the item is in stock when I click "buy".
  15. 0lybacker

    0lybacker In the Stop Bath

    Well, the thing I found with a dotty aunt in real life was that it was less fun when she wasn't here any more. Think the same may apply to AP's 'old mad uncle' ... life isn't dull when he's around! ;) :D
  16. 0lybacker

    0lybacker In the Stop Bath

    Not so bothered by ads like that as I would resort to a magnifier, too, if the reading glasses have not been updated in a while. More bits for sale & on show, the better, as far as I'm concerned. Mind you, I'm trying not to buy more kit at the moment!

    You could be on to something there, having the wife read the ads to you. Might make it easier to infiltrate that new lens or flash unit that you wanted into the household. ;)

    My beef with the photo mags is when they use blindingly small pics, especially when testing lenses. It is pointless! Anything less than a half page full bleed is not really going to show what a lens or sensor can do. Ideally, it should be a whole page. Probably will need to be double page spreads, soon.
  17. Catriona

    Catriona Well-Known Member

    Very true!
    My shameful admission is that when I look at the before and after (edited) pictures feature, I very often either don't see any difference - or the before actually looks better than the after! I do consider my observation quite good too.
  18. PeteRob

    PeteRob Well-Known Member

    I've been scratching my head over the 5Diii v the 5Ds v the 5Dsr review on onlandscape purporting to show the huge improvement in resolution. I think I must need a bigger monitor.
  19. PhotoEcosse

    PhotoEcosse Well-Known Member

    There are a lot of things worse than being a "mad uncle".

    I had a smelly auntie (actually she was my father's auntie).
  20. 0lybacker

    0lybacker In the Stop Bath

    I think one of the problems with photo mags is that for some years now they are put together and mostly viewed by the editorial team on vast Mac screens, with no gutter, no roller creases, etc.. When they want to look closely at something to check quality they just hit the magnify button - like we do in front of our PCs, laptops - which the hard copy reader cannot do.

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