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Take part in round 3 of APOY 2014 - World in Motion

Discussion in 'Amateur Photographer Of the Year (APOY)' started by Chrissie_Lay, May 7, 2014.

  1. PeteRob

    PeteRob Well-Known Member

    I keep looking at the gravity-defying (or more surely certain death) shot in second place. The lighting on the figure looks if anything like ring flash! Is this for real or is it a montage?
  2. Catriona

    Catriona Well-Known Member

    I would go for montage. The lighting is definitely 'different'!
  3. PMurrell

    PMurrell Well-Known Member

    Again, looking at the top 30 it appears that a few of the shortlisted can also convincingly qualify for the current Portrait and upcoming Dusk/Dawn Landscape rounds.
  4. Dalton54

    Dalton54 Member

    This is the first time I have used the forum and has been more than a year since I set myself up. So, as you can see, I'm not often moved to say something, but when I saw this shot I was certain that it was a montage and am even more convinced the more I look at it. I seem to remember reading an earlier comments on the forum that AP fundamentally supports photography that has not been overly manipulated and will mark down shots that have been too heavily processed. From the comments on this picture it would appear that the judges did not consider the possiblity that this was a composite picture. If we were absolutely convinced that judges were rigorous in their approach then I would give this picture the benefit of the doubt but after seeing the earlier comments about the same or similar pictures being rewarded in successive years I am inclined to worry that the judges have not got their eye on the ball - or the shot.
  5. lm1

    lm1 Well-Known Member

    Hi Dalton, having made it into the top 30 for the first time I am obviously very happy with the judges this month! :D
    But seriously, regarding your point I don't think there is anything in the rules preventing this. All I can see is the statement 'Judges are looking for original, imaginative and well-executed pictures that explore the theme in an exciting way.'
    In 2012 this made the top 30 and I have to say at the time I was surprised that level of PS was allowed and raises the question of when something stops being a photograph...but it was definitely allowed!

  6. Dalton54

    Dalton54 Member

    Hi Lucie,

    First of all - many congrats on making it into the magazine -it's a big thrill to see a picture you have taken recognised by AP as worthy of appearing within its pages. Hope we will see a lot more of your work.

    And I agree there is nothing in the rules to prevent manipulation of an image as, to some extent, most images do have some post-production work done on them. The real question is how much and to what purpose. When I raised my point I was vaguely aware of some guidance that had been given last year in the magazine in relation to a picture that appeared in the Black and White round. Although I don't have the magazine in which the reader's point was replied to I have been able to see a reflection of what was said there in the forum thread on last years Round 7 and, at the end of that thread, that the reply from AP confirmed that it was OK to composite pictures but that they would achieved a lower score than they might have but for the manipulation. So I can only assume that if the woman in this shot actually had been trying to kill herself the picture would have won. I think my real point, however, was doubting that the judges were actually noticing such things as the comments on the leaping woman seemed to show no recognition that it was - in all likelihood - a composite shot, and if they had recognised it as such would it have made second place? I was only using what seems to be AP's own criteria to ask if the judges are indeed paying attention - as they clearly didn't with the twice submitted photograph of the Kingfisher.

  7. andytraill

    andytraill Well-Known Member

    To be fair #3 has a touch of the composite to me too. Can't be sure though.
  8. PMurrell

    PMurrell Well-Known Member

  9. PMurrell

    PMurrell Well-Known Member

    Pin sharp I meant!
  10. Dalton54

    Dalton54 Member

    Hi, yes I can see this and so did the judges. That is not my point. My point is not that manipulation shouldn't be allowed but rather - are the judges recognising it for what it is? Quoting from what the judges said in relation to the second placed picture - "All we need is this wonderfully observed shot". So it appears that the judges were impressed into giving this shot some of the marks they awarded as they believed the picture to be something that was photographed as it appears in the shot. Had they recognised it as a composite shot which was not "well observed" would it have ended up with the same mark? I'm not on a campaign here against this particular shot - I'm just asking if the judges are really paying attention to what they are looking at - as they have already been seen to fail in recognising a shot that had already published in AP in a similar round last year.

  11. John71

    John71 New Member

    I too wondered if the 2nd place picture was a montage/composite - and I'm still not sure. However the photograph is found in the photographer's Flickr account and is followed by one featuring the same woman (the one in the second place picture) getting out of the water. The photos appear to have been taken at a place called "Forty Foot" in Ireland. A Google Image search finds lots of pictures featuring people jumping into the sea at this place. So maybe the 2nd place entry is real.

    I have no connection with the photographer.
  12. PeteRob

    PeteRob Well-Known Member

    Inspired by your research - Sandycove - near Dublin. It took me a while to find the winning shot and indeed the lady leaving the water. So just goes to show. Recently I have seen published two other photos of ladies plunging into the sea which, together with the lighting, made me wonder if this was a theme inspired montage.

    Just to confuse further this shot seems to show a standing dive from the ledge above the iron work.


    and looks just as suicidal.

    Someone will wonder why their Flickr count has gone up :)
  13. PMurrell

    PMurrell Well-Known Member

    I've learnt a couple of valuable lessons on this and the Appraisal thread over the last 2 days.

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