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Someone wants to buy exclusive rights

Discussion in 'Help Team' started by Sphinx, May 4, 2017.

  1. Sphinx

    Sphinx Well-Known Member

    Hey guys need some serious advice.
    I have been taking shots of football matches my son and his team play in. I have made them available for low res download for free to the team, opposition parents etc (team is 16 to 20 age group it is an educational establishment)
    Team made it to a league final which was played last night - this morning I have received an email asking if I would be interested in selling exclusive rights for the league pictures to the league.
    Advice needed on what sort of price, how this affects pictures people have already downloaded, how to approach the matter of people wanting pictures of last nights match and any general pitfalls this invitation may involve.
    I took the pictures for the boys and their families, I have not made money from any copyrighted or trademarked brand such as the league. It has given me pleasure seeing people download my work - but I am not opposed to being paid, i just dont want to dump the people I started for.
     
  2. 0lybacker

    0lybacker In the Stop Bath

    OK, Sphinx, here goes:
    Usage overseas doesn't count probably in this case but you need to check that.
    Web use as well as print publication or web alone?
    Would the pictures be sold on once you grant exclusive use?
    Would the rights be time limited?
    Would you transfer copyright permanently?
    Would you have a measure of joint right as creator always?
    Or only after a period?
    Local use, excluding web or with web?
    Nationwide use, excluding web or with web?
    Photographer receiving credit line or not?

    You may find some pricing help on the Association of Photographers web-site as well as one of their publications. I hope I have got all the options but may have forgotten some.
     
  3. PeteRob

    PeteRob Well-Known Member

    i'd talk to them to see why they want exclusive rights. If you already posted them on-line for download then at least some of the exclusivity is lost. They may just wish to use them for publicity so exclusivity doesn't come into it. If they want them for resale then that goes against what you have been doing.
     
  4. Sphinx

    Sphinx Well-Known Member

    Thank you for your quick reply. I will now go and hide under the bed lol.

    Isnt it amazing how quickly the delight of people expressing interest develops the concrete boots of commercial reality? I will go and have a look at the website draft up some initial response to just let them know I am not a complete innocent and get on with processing the photos from last night.

    To blow it all our team lost on penalties.
     
  5. Sphinx

    Sphinx Well-Known Member

    I have never been opposed to sale - the agreement has been low res downloads are free if anyone wants prints or high quality files suitable for printing money may become involved.

    It would not be a problem for future matches its more last nights match as I was (as usual) approached by parents of the opposition and I told them the same as I always do the pictures will be available as low res downloads on Saturday.
     
    Roger Hicks likes this.
  6. Geren

    Geren Well-Known Member

    Well you can't go round asking for money from people for things you've already given them for free, so whatever contract you enter into with the league will have to have a date from which they have exclusivity. You then need to set about answering all of Olybacker's questions to work out just what is meant by 'exclusive rights'. For instance, when I do product photography for a client, I grant them the right to use the images for web or print for as long as they wish and for whatever purpose they see fit to advertise their product or business, but they can't sell them on to someone else. I retain the copyright and I retain the right to sell them to someone else should someone else decide they want them.

    Once you have answered all of Olybacker's questions, that really only leaves the question of what to do about the people who have been used to being able to download your stuff for free. They won't be able to, is the short answer. You might want to find out if the league will be banning all other photography at these events because otherwise it seems to make a bit of a mockery of the exclusivity element - your pics might be better than everyone else's but they won't be the only ones. I'd have a conversation with them and see just what they think they mean by exclusive rights. Paying you to use your images so that nobody else can have them suggests that they want to sell them - otherwise they'd just be paying you to use them for publicity purposes and it wouldn't matter who else had low res versions on their facebook pages - in fact the more the merrier. If they want to sell them, they may stop other people from taking photographs in order not to weaken their value. If you refuse to let that happen by not selling them the exclusive rights they may tell you that you can't take any more photographs while they find someone who's just keen to make some money. I know, I'm terribly cynical, but I think you need to figure out their motivation before you decide.
     
  7. Sphinx

    Sphinx Well-Known Member

    Actually you have reassured me somewhat - I would take a rough guess that the league are less informed about commercial photography and rights than I am. This gives me slightly more leverage in negotiating to keep the teams and parents options to the low res images.
     
  8. Roger Hicks

    Roger Hicks Well-Known Member

    Who's buying, and why?

    A lot depends on whether it's for a national newspaper, or a greetings card, or an advertising campaign. In the latter cases you might need model releases, too.

    Cheers,

    R.
     
  9. Sphinx

    Sphinx Well-Known Member

    Oh I forgot to say all my work is clearly made available under creative commons at the moment - attribution no commercial no derivatives which does help for stuff already downloaded.
     
  10. Sphinx

    Sphinx Well-Known Member

    If the league has any commercial sense whatsoever they have included model release into their terms for playing in the league in the first place. Obviously they have had lots of previous pictures taken and used of the teams - it may very well be they are just wanting to force parents/players to go through them for photos they dont take themselves and are being nice about it offering money instead of telling me to stop outright - which they would have problems with as I am a parent as well. All this is in the grey area of personal use - I take photos of my son, my sons friends ask me to take photos of them, I share the photos I have taken.
     
  11. Sphinx

    Sphinx Well-Known Member

    As suspected they are not remotely after exclusive rights - they want rights to use in marketing and social media without watermarks and I am loathe to grant them exclusive social media rights as I take the pictures for the boys in the team to be able to put on their social media.
     
    Geren and Roger Hicks like this.
  12. MJB

    MJB Well-Known Member

    I'm puzzled as to why they want, or indeed need exclusive rights. We're not talking the Premier League here.
     
    Roger Hicks likes this.
  13. Roger Hicks

    Roger Hicks Well-Known Member

    At which point, I am reminded of the days when the late Frostie was still funny, in TW3:

    "And now, a message for the inhabitants of Gomorrah. Sodom,"

    Or of course sod 'em.

    Cheers,

    R.
     
  14. Sphinx

    Sphinx Well-Known Member

    I replied politely saying I am happy to consider a price for hi res files for marketing but not social media exclusivity because I take the pictures so the players can share with their friends and family.
     
  15. Roger Hicks

    Roger Hicks Well-Known Member

    The perfect response, I'd have thought.

    Cheers,

    R.
     
    Learning and Sphinx like this.
  16. 0lybacker

    0lybacker In the Stop Bath

    Geren, Sorry, maybe I didn't make it clear - those questions are for the client, not Sphinx. He needs to know exactly what they want before he can scale his fee accordingly. Cheers, Oly
     
  17. Geren

    Geren Well-Known Member

    Indeed yes!
     

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