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Dslr v csc

Discussion in 'AP Magazine Feedback & Suggestions' started by Grierson, Apr 2, 2015.

  1. Grierson

    Grierson Well-Known Member

    As I ponder the possibility of p/xing my Canon 70-200mm and 100mm macro lenses for the new 100-400mm lens I'm driven to consider the sense of continuing with a heavy DSLR and an array equally heavy lenses. Prompted by the news of the immanent release of Nikon's new offering I wonder if time has come, or perhaps has yet to arrive yet to arrive, when CSCs have/will become a viable alternative to DSLRs, in terms of picture quality and flexibility of use, for the dedicated enthusiast amateur photographer.

    How's about a piece in AP from the technical team looking at the current field in both camps and perhaps also doing a little crystal ball gazing. :)
     
  2. Scphoto

    Scphoto Well-Known Member

    I think picture quality isn't the issue with CSC's it's the lack of a decent viewfinder and lack of lenses.

    The selling point (and boy do CSC owners bang on about this) is they've all traded in their heavy DSLRs and now have smaller and lighter kit (however once you have an interchangeable lens system it stops being small and portable anyway).
     
  3. Ffolrord

    Ffolrord Well-Known Member

    Lack of lenses?

    There are some excellent and comprehensive choices out there. CSC might not cover certain specialist areas like the DSLR market but it doesn't need to. I think the vast majority of users are more than adequately catered for. In fact I'd say much more interesting than certain APSC ranges.
     
  4. 0lybacker

    0lybacker In the Stop Bath

    I can sympathise!

    The Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse all admired the Pannie GX7 at TPS last year with one of them referring to it as a 'Retirement Camera' aka 'A Camera for Retired Pros' or 'A Camera to help Pros Retire!' :eek: :).

    Two of the four have acquired one in the last year (including the member furthest below 65 years of age); one has a GM1 and bought a bargain GM5 at TPS this year. 'Syd the Socialite', the oldest Horseman & well past retirement age, is torn between a desire to be a full frame Nikon shooter and complaining about the weight of his D300 kit which includes many full-frame lenses!

    The EVF on the GM5 is very good. New lenses are coming along all the time, including wide fixies. Beats the various APS based formats into extinction ... possibly.
     
  5. PeteRob

    PeteRob Well-Known Member

    It is definitely not the picture quality. It is the different viewfinder. I bought a Fuji X-E2, mainly on the back of an AP review, for days when It is not convenient to carry an SLR and as an improvement on a compact. The results are fantastic but I don't like the ELV compared with the optical finder on a 5D.
     
  6. IvorETower

    IvorETower Little Buttercup

    Depends on what you want a CSC for. If you are into wide-angle shots, eg you are an estate agent and want interior shots, then CSC wide-angle lenses are seriously expensive... in many cases, more expensive than full-frame wide-angle lenses!
    3 main options then.... don't shoot wide, pay a lot of money for the lenses or use a cheap screw-on adapter on your "kit" lens.

    For "normal" angles of view and telephoto lenses, the best CSC's are now so close in performance to DSLRs that you almost certainly won't tell the difference.

    However, as has been pointed out already, almost all CSCs do not have a viewfinder, and on those that do, it is of course electronic with a refresh rate rather than "real life" viewed through a mirror. Personally I have not yet found one of these viewfinders that does not annoy me and upset my vision. So if you can live with the view on a rear LCD and don't want wide-angle lenses then a CSC is smaller and much lighter than carting around a DSLR, even with an equivalent number of additional lenses included.

    EDIT: the one area in my experience where DSLRs continue to win hands-down is in tracking fast moving subjects and keeping them in focus, eg planes at air displays, racing cars etc. Again, if your likely subjects include these, then think seriously before ditching your DSLR
     
  7. Sejanus.Aelianus

    Sejanus.Aelianus In the Stop Bath

    I use both SLRs and CSCs; I like both types; the viewfinders work on both types; the lenses are good on both types; the pictures that come out of both types are equally good or bad.

    I can't see what anyone would have a problem with, whichever they use...

    [​IMG]
     
  8. spinno

    spinno Well-Known Member

    Where's the Pentax?
     
  9. Benchista

    Benchista Which Tyler

    I can't use EVFs because of a medical condition, so that is rather limiting for some uses.
    However, I love my little EOS M and it's great lenses, even if there aren't many - actually, the wideangle is the best of the lot. And I can use all my other lenses with an adaptor.

    I also love the little Pentax Q - terrific fun.

    Wouldn't ever want to sacrifice a DSLR for them, though.
     
  10. MartyG

    MartyG Well-Known Member

    I enjoy the comparison articles in AP so a CSC vs DSLR vs Compacts would definitely be read by me.

    There's no brand loyalty in this household either :)

    [​IMG]
     
  11. spinno

    spinno Well-Known Member

    Because of ongoing medical problems I have had to change my whole outlook because sooner or later I will be unable to lug anything heavier than a feather around for more than a few minutes.
    In my apparent wisdom I have decided to have a Canon 100D, Canon Eos M and now I'm on the lookout for a Pentax Q-variant.
    These cameras are what I will be using, plus a couple of compacts that I still have. I reckoned that combined with a few smallish zooms I will be able to carry on snapping for a good few more years yet.
     
  12. Andy Westlake

    Andy Westlake AP Staff

    It's definitely on the cards. We're thinking about various options for doing exactly this kind of article.

    --
    Andy Westlake
    Technical Editor, Amateur Photographer
     
  13. Derek_R

    Derek_R Well-Known Member

    Being new to this photography lark with any degree of seriousness I don't have any existing attachments to DSLRs and, pretty much purely by accident (and price) started with CSCs.

    I find the size of DSLRs incredible. Was almost tempted by a D7100 recently but that thing is huge. Yet, just about everyone else in my photography class have DSLRs and some of those make the D7100 look tiny.

    I've not had any problems with the EVFs or OVFs on my little herd of cameras (a Lumix G3, an X-Pro, and an X100s) - although I must admit I peered through a Fuji XT-1 recently and that EVF was incredible. I guess you don't miss what you never had.

    I do also have a borrowed Nikon D5100 - but since I got the X-Pro the Nikon has not been used. I would agree that for speed of focus and tracking, and for choice of very long lenses, the DSLR still reigns supreme, but for what I want (hang the camera round my neck whilst I go cycling or walking) the CSC's do me fine. I think the display on the back of the D5100 is better than any of the others. The battery life is way better, of course. But the handling is pants. I don't notice anything better about the OVF on the Nikon compared to the Fujis.
     
  14. Sejanus.Aelianus

    Sejanus.Aelianus In the Stop Bath

    Yep! Aren't they great? :D

    Still, the finest camera in the world is the one in your hand when the picture is in front of you. I was standing in a village near Heathrow,yesterday, when the "mighty whale" flew over. Three feet away, in the boot of my car, was a Nikon with a long lens fitted. In my pocket was a Panasonic TZ40. I don't know what anyone else would have done but I yanked out the Panny. It may not be much of a picture but it's a lot better than the empty sky I'd have got, by the time I'd grabbed the Nikon...

    :D

    [​IMG]
     
  15. Grierson

    Grierson Well-Known Member

    I'll look forward with interest to any forthcoming article Andy, thanks.

    I too agree with many that a decent view finder is a must. I just can't see that viewing the rear screen at arms length with a longish lens attached won't contribute to camera shake.

    My ideal CSC would have:

    A sensor with a size/pixel density relationship the performance of which is at least equal to the IQ of the 5D2.
    A set of small lenses which would contribute to achieving the above.
    Minimal controls but of decent size.
    Effective image stabilisation.
    A good sized viewfinder.
    A small well designed body which fits well in the hand.
    A good battery life.

    I don't need WiFi, Near Field Communication or video although I accept that adding these facilities are likely to add little to the final cost. If they must be there tuck them away on a remote menu screen not on extra buttons. :)

    I haven't read all the current specs. but I don't think what is described above exists. Perhaps I'm wrong. :(
     
  16. LargeFormat

    LargeFormat Well-Known Member

    Sounds quite like a Sony 7II.
     
  17. Grierson

    Grierson Well-Known Member

    Aye, but for £1.5k! :D
     
  18. art

    art Well-Known Member

    This seems to be a very personal thing. I've never been bothered by the size of SLRs/DSLRs and actually find them reassuringly solid. In fact, I use a battery grip on my 70D just to give a bit of extra 'heft' (and on my 350D before it).

    I remember the Olympus OM1 & 2 SLRs were heavily marketed on their smaller-than-most size, but it never seemed a big deal to me, though I fully accept it's an important factor for many people - and the OM cameras were pretty successful as I remember, which must prove something.
     
  19. Sejanus.Aelianus

    Sejanus.Aelianus In the Stop Bath

    Well, of course, some dSLRs are bigger than others...

    :D :D :D

    [​IMG]
     
  20. MartyG

    MartyG Well-Known Member

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