Lazza
journeyman
Reged: 27/01/2008
Posts: 84
Loc: Zider Country ... Ooh Arrr
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About to purchase an R8 as I return to the full joys of throwing off the digital shackles and back to enjoying life in the slow lane of Velvia, tri-X & manual focus ...ah bliss. 
The one thing that kind of bothers me is the R8 serial number/reliability situation as there's a fair bit of info that creates a bit of a negative scene around buying an R8. So what I'm asking is for the views of you "real" R8 owners out there and your views on the matter. Should I pay attention to the likes of for instance:- http://leica-users.org/v18/msg11878.html or should I simply just get on and buy the best one I find ignoring serial numbers completely? I don't, as yet, have any plans to buy/use the R8 winder if that might make a difference to the final answer.
Any help from Leica R8 owners past or present will be greatly appreciated, thanks!
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parisian
Over the hill and far away...
Reged: 10/02/2002
Posts: 9299
Loc: Môn mam cymru
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Here is mine..........
Well, the digital version anyway 
I have owned mine for three years or so now and to be honest I think it is probably the best 35mm SLR ever produced. Nothing excessive just pure function and that design? stunning!
Lenses are so good that many Canon users are buying the necessary adaptor to use them on their 5D's etc. - there are none better.
Good luck and don't worry one jot (I assume you are buying from a dealer?)
Let us know how you get on.
I expect that Tim will be along shortly to tell you more
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Hells pensioner - born to be mild
JustMono
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TimF
Taking it strictly
Reged: 30/07/2001
Posts: 18961
Loc: Herts/Beds border
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My R8 is a 2293xxx, so maybe I should start freaking out, eh! However, no problems to date with it (the DMR has an R9 attached). At this stage of the game I would imagine that most cameras which had problems will have been sent back to Leica for repair or replacement, but if you are still concerned, then obviously the advice given in the link to seek out a later serial number is reasonable. I think Leica are pretty reasonable with sorting out an inherent problem (as opposed to one that develops from use/misuse). Earlier this year I sent a pre-aspheric 35mm Summilux-M for adjustment as it wouldn't focus to infinity on my M8. They could reasonably have levied a charge for the job, as there are plenty of alternatives in that focal length, but it was done F.O.C.
A few years back I did briefly own another R8 + winder. This had an intermittent problem of locking up, which I blamed - perhaps unfairly - on the winder, as there was no problem without it. My current body has the Motor Drive R8 mounted; that makes it fairly large (though a touch smaller than a Canon 1Ds FWIW), but the handling is superb as Peter has already alluded.
Regarding your consideration of the winder, this does have the advantage of using regular batteries IIRC, whereas the MD uses a proprietary rechargeable. That battery is now only obtainable new from Leica's service department. I bought three to go with the one god one that came with the drive (another that got thrown in with the deal turned out to be dead). If that were not an issue, I would recommend the drive over the winder anyday though.
As Peter says, buy from a dealer. If any problems arise then you do have the shop guarantee to get it fixed at their cost. Some dealers may not like your using that, but do so. It's what it's for after all.
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Tim BSRIPN
If I had all the money I've spent on drink, I'd spend it on drink
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Mark_Norton
Reged: 29/06/2002
Posts: 1334
Loc: London, UK
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I think you should talk to Leica about repair costs because I believe the cost of fixing the light meter in an R8 is more than the camera is worth. Maybe an R9 is better and although Tim is correct that you can mount R lenses on Canon, Nikon and Pentax bodies, you do loose the level of automation (auto-aperture, open aperture metering and so on).
I toyed with buying some Leica R glass to put on my Nikons but the loss of functionality is just too great (and I'm ignoring AF here).
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Mark
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TimF
Taking it strictly
Reged: 30/07/2001
Posts: 18961
Loc: Herts/Beds border
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Quote:
Tim is correct that you can mount R lenses on Canon, Nikon and Pentax bodies
I think Peter said that. 
The R9 is not very different to the R8. The only obvious change is the addition of a locking button to the on/off/mode selector dial, which I'm not 100% sold on. It's also slightly lighter I believe. The main problem is sourcing a used sample as they seem quite thin on the ground compared to the R8. Boris at SH Photo has new bodies listed at the discounted clearance price, but still in excess of €1,000. The Leicashop also has some used ones I think; listed under R8 (black) on their Leica R bodies page.
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Tim BSRIPN
If I had all the money I've spent on drink, I'd spend it on drink
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Lazza
journeyman
Reged: 27/01/2008
Posts: 84
Loc: Zider Country ... Ooh Arrr
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The deed is done.
Thanks guy's for all your advice, really very much appreciated and overall what I was thinking too re: worrying about problems etc. Just reserved a boxed body at Ffordes with a late 27xxxxx serial No, boxed black chrome, a few marks on it yes but a camera's for using right? The wife is going to kill me!  (Just purchased an Epson V700 Peter to complete my Figital set-up, that's how I know the wife is going to explode!)
Also managed to get hold of a Summicron R 50mm 3 cam for a mere £150 too on eBay (Came off an R4, owner put lens ad in Pentax section by mistake to my good fortune .... I hope.) so should be set-up by the weekend as a Leica user for the very first time ..... apart from an old projector back in the 1970's I inherited.
Again many thanks, I'm sure I shall be back soon with plenty of questions.
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TimF
Taking it strictly
Reged: 30/07/2001
Posts: 18961
Loc: Herts/Beds border
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Ha! Ha! You've fallen into my carefully laid trap. There's no escape now; that 50mm will induce large quantities of GAS!
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Tim BSRIPN
If I had all the money I've spent on drink, I'd spend it on drink
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Lazza
journeyman
Reged: 27/01/2008
Posts: 84
Loc: Zider Country ... Ooh Arrr
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Quote:
Ha! Ha! You've fallen into my carefully laid trap. There's no escape now; that 50mm will induce large quantities of GAS!
I know, I know. There's the 35-70mm f/4 to save up for next too! I have been lurking around this forum for a while but that was mainly with a view to buying an M6 for street photography and here I am ... buying the complete opposite of what I planned. I just felt that an M6 attracts far too much attention on shall we say the seedier streets of our country and shall carry on using my trusty £30 chrome Olympus OM-2 that nobody looks at ever with the view of mugging me for. Lighter than an M series too and with 50mm lens mounted and a wide angle in pocket easy & light to travel with especially when using a "Y-Strap".
I am having second thoughts I must admit but only over whether I should have spent more money on an R8 body in mint-ish condition in chrome as opposed to black (Ffordes don't have any really better black ones - seemed very honest with their descriptions over the phone I found which is refreshing), guess I could still change my mind with my R8 being reserved and not yet paid for but other than a few light scratches and a scuff on the rear I'm too tight to spend the extra £50 on a slightly better body in the colour option least preferred (not that it *really* matters) for something that after all is designed to be used. I'm not usually this indecisive, maybe this has been brought on by impending Leica ownership? 
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parisian
Over the hill and far away...
Reged: 10/02/2002
Posts: 9299
Loc: Môn mam cymru
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Gotcha Lazza, you are now a bona fide Leicaphile
I have the 35-70 which for some reason Leica decided not to term 'asph'despite it having an aspherical element. The quality of image is at least equal to the primes it replaces. Not the fastest lens but can be used Leica style, wide open unlike so many of it's contemporaries.
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Hells pensioner - born to be mild
JustMono
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Lazza
journeyman
Reged: 27/01/2008
Posts: 84
Loc: Zider Country ... Ooh Arrr
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Summicron 50mm came this morning (Canadian build), the glass looks perfect with nice action, damping so can't wait to try it on the body which I should get tomorrow. Not bad for £150 eh?
Sometimes eBay bargains can really surprise you (the ad was not very descriptive of condition really with 1 poor pic but the seller had good feedback and was the owner too so took a calculated gamble being a Leicaphile that he'd looked after it well), more often they disappoint. This one turned up trumps for the money. Bought a Canon A1 in Exc++ cond a while back for £10 and that was with a Tokina 35-105mm as well.
Saw 2 mint R8's go through on eBay yesterday at the £370 ish mark which was tempting I know but a 6 month warranty from Ffordes for a slightly poorer condition camera is the wiser thing for that sort of money I'm sure even if a gamble on one from eBay did turn out good, not worth the risk is it?
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parisian
Over the hill and far away...
Reged: 10/02/2002
Posts: 9299
Loc: Môn mam cymru
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Quote:
I'm sure even if a gamble on one from eBay did turn out good, not worth the risk is it?
No.
Not when there are sufficient in dealers stock rooms. A small price premium is well worth the peace of mind.
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Hells pensioner - born to be mild
JustMono
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Lazza
journeyman
Reged: 27/01/2008
Posts: 84
Loc: Zider Country ... Ooh Arrr
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Camera arrived today, first thoughts - It's big, it's blinkin heavy, it's beautiful!
Considering the condition Ffordes described it over the phone I was expecting the worst but it goes to show how durable "black chrome" is over the other manu's usual black paint, it's not bad at all and everything seems to work just nicely as it should.
One thing I have found, and I knew before fitting it, is that the standard Leica strap is no good for man or beast with the weight of this baby. I was tracking a new Leica neoprene strap on eBay for £36 but that sold and the other examples I am looking at seem to vary between £68 - £100 + P&P from the USA. 
I've heard very good things about Niggeloh neoprene straps (and they will fit the R8 fittings just nicely! And after comparing with the Leica strap it looks as though they are one and the same with exactly the same fittings and being German I'm convinced they are.) and can get one for around £18 so think I will plump for that, after years of using Nikon F2A's, F4s's & D200 with a grip and suffering with severe osteo arthritis I now know how important a strap that bears the load well really is and more often than not standard straps never cut it.
I'll tell you what though, I have owned plenty of cameras (and still do) over the years but now I *really* know what camera LOVE is! 
Edited by Lazza (13/05/2009 17:22)
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TimF
Taking it strictly
Reged: 30/07/2001
Posts: 18961
Loc: Herts/Beds border
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Did you get a manual with the camera? Like most Leica kit, the usage is pretty straightforward, but if you feel the need the almost identical R9 manual can be downloaded from here. Don't forget to register your kit in the Owner's Login section, eh!
Niggeloh is a new name to me. The company's web site is rather less than helpful sadly. Where will you get the strap from?
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Tim BSRIPN
If I had all the money I've spent on drink, I'd spend it on drink
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Lazza
journeyman
Reged: 27/01/2008
Posts: 84
Loc: Zider Country ... Ooh Arrr
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Quote:
Did you get a manual with the camera? Like most Leica kit, the usage is pretty straightforward, but if you feel the need the almost identical R9 manual can be downloaded from here. Don't forget to register your kit in the Owner's Login section, eh!
Niggeloh is a new name to me. The company's web site is rather less than helpful sadly. Where will you get the strap from?
Funnily enough there was a manual but it was for an R9, Already managed to d/l an R8 manual though so that's OK and they are so similar anyway as you will know.
No, I'd never heard of them before Tim but after doing a search for owners views of Op Tech straps came across problems of them breaking and a few people raving about these Niggeloh ones. Here's the direct eBay link and it's from a German dealer:- http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&item=120412689061
As I said, apart from there being no Leica branding on the strap to my eyes it's identical.
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Benchista
Which Tyler
Reged: 11/08/2000
Posts: 42225
Loc: Everywhere and nowhere, baby
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I've got a Niggeloh neoprene strap on my 5D that I've had for years - it first got used on my EOS 100. It's a different design, except for the clips. It's served me very well indeed, and I think I bought it from Jacobs.
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Nick
www.nbrphoto.com
Light and Shade II - the new blog
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Lazza
journeyman
Reged: 27/01/2008
Posts: 84
Loc: Zider Country ... Ooh Arrr
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Got to using my R8 for the first time yesterday in shooting a test roll and have a query?
I'm used to various Nikon's from the F2 onwards and a nice shutter action with not that much noticeable mirror slap. However, what I've noticed about using the R8 so far is that no matter what the shutter speed is that when the shutter is fired it's almost like a shotgun going off when compared to my Nikon .... say an FA for instance. And I can only put this down to mirror slap.
Now (At the risk of causing upset to my new fellow Leicaphiles ...sorry! ) with a sophisticated camera such as this I'm quite surprised. Is it supposed to be like this? I mean there are no visible faults within the mirror box, the small buffers either side of the focus screen are perfect etc. DX coding working fine, meter working perfectly on all modes etc so cannot think there's anything wrong with the camera. I know it's a big boy but I was expecting something crisp and light in action but this is a very heavy resounding clunk at all speeds?!? Is this how it is and something I'll just get used to or could there be a problem?
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TimF
Taking it strictly
Reged: 30/07/2001
Posts: 18961
Loc: Herts/Beds border
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'Tis not the quietest beast on the planet for sure!
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Tim BSRIPN
If I had all the money I've spent on drink, I'd spend it on drink
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Lazza
journeyman
Reged: 27/01/2008
Posts: 84
Loc: Zider Country ... Ooh Arrr
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Quote:
'Tis not the quietest beast on the planet for sure!
You're not wrong there Tim.
Funnily, to me because with this build quality I cannot imagine much variation, after checking it out via Google some owners say it's quiet?!?! (Have they ever tried an M6 I ask? The R8 is more akin to the M16 ! lol) Whilst many say noisy.
I'll get used to it I'm sure, didn't buy it for street shooting anyway so not too bothered just thought it strange that's all for a camera of this build quality. I must say that so far I love the metering and also the film loading, though I do find it difficult to avoid winding the film leader back into the film cannister on rewind (as it's so smooth/quiet) even with my ear on the back of the camera. Ooh I am fussy!
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TimF
Taking it strictly
Reged: 30/07/2001
Posts: 18961
Loc: Herts/Beds border
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Quote:
not too bothered just thought it strange that's all for a camera of this build quality.
Maybe, but then again, the Nikon F (build like a Tiger Tank) is not exactly whisper quiet either. The motor drive I have fitted to mine is a throw back to those rackety 70s add-on drives too! Ah well, it's the lenses for which people buy Leica anyhoo.
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Tim BSRIPN
If I had all the money I've spent on drink, I'd spend it on drink
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kennethcooke
newbie
Reged: 11/05/2008
Posts: 14
Loc: West Riding of Yorkshire
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Is an SLR imperative to the style of photography you wish to pursue. If not have you considered an M system. I had the use of an R8 for a couple of weeks last year and it had three electronics faults which is the only problem when a camera is battery reliant. R8, because Leica have now discontinued it's R range is a good buy and R lenses are also well priced on the used market whereas M system cameras tend to be somewhat more expensive but hold there value much better. I used Nikon SLR's for years but since swapping to Leica rangefinder cameras my photography has been re born and I have never missed the features of an SLR. Only you can decide but I thought I'd throw this into the equation.
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"Sharpness is a bourgeois concept"- H. Cartier Bresson
Regards Kenneth
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