ACS
For Whom the Bell Trolls...
Reged: 04/09/2007
Posts: 50
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"Tokyo, 5 August 2008, Olympus Imaging Corporation (Olympus Imaging) and Matsushita Electric Industrial Co., Ltd. (Panasonic) today announced joint development of technologies and devices for the "Micro Four Thirds System standard," a new standard that extends the benefits of the Four Thirds System standard for interchangeable lens type digital camera systems by enabling dramatic reductions in size and weight. Under the terms of an agreement between the two companies, they will work jointly toward commercial production of significantly lighter and more compact interchangeable lens type digital camera systems."
http://www.dpreview.com/news/0808/08080501microfourthirds.asp
You're probably all aware of this (I may have nodded off there for a week or two) but here it is in case you're not.
I'm assuming it'll be met by loud yawns from some quarters (you remember Mr. 'Dust problem? What dust problem?') for example.
But I think its the neatest thing since, um, well, since Oly cleaned up with the Pen FT in 1963, which also produced blisteringly sharp images in 4:3 format...
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Fen
BAD WOLF
Reged: 12/03/2002
Posts: 20924
Loc: Currently Unknown!
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AP already have it and it's being discussed here 
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Fen .......... My Galleries - My Blog - My Flickr
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ACS
For Whom the Bell Trolls...
Reged: 04/09/2007
Posts: 50
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Thanks!
And delighted the reactions are true to form.
I've been saving up for a Pen FT, but the prices on ebay are completely nuts. Maybe one of these microfourthirds thingys will be just the job.
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Iloca
Unregistered at user's request
Reged: 06/12/2005
Posts: 3800
Loc: Northern Ireland
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I don't get it to be honest, who is it aimed at?
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Mi Vid Iloca
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Benchista
Wich Tyler
Reged: 11/08/2000
Posts: 37849
Loc: Everywhere and nowhere, baby
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Me, I hope.
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Nick
www.nbrphoto.com
Light and Shade II - the new blog
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El Sid
Going potty
Reged: 14/04/2003
Posts: 9463
Loc: Sussex-by-the-Sea
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People upgrading from compacts apparently...
I suspect that if the actual camera and lenses are sufficiently compact it may have rather more appeal to those who are looking for something G9 sized but with a bigger sensor.
It'll be interesting to see how it sits alongside the normal 4/3rds. If the quality, features and operability of the cameras and lenses are up to scratch I can't help wondering if it may actually have more appeal to those looking for a versatile but compact camera with interchangeable lenses in which case it may seriously erode the sales of normal 4/3rds - enough even to dangerously reduce the viability of the E system?...
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Nigel
Completely BSRIPN 
ElSid Gallery
A camera in the hand is better than one in the cupboard........
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Iloca
Unregistered at user's request
Reged: 06/12/2005
Posts: 3800
Loc: Northern Ireland
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Quote:
Me, I hope.
How can it? EVF, too small to allow anything other than menu driven operation. Rather you than me
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Mi Vid Iloca
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RogerMac
Hotshoe Shuffler
Reged: 25/03/2007
Posts: 497
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Well I have been actively looking for a camera that would double as a "take anywhere" camera for me and also an easy to use compact for my wife. I had been considering a 420 + pancake but it seemed not quite small enough for that first use, and compacts like the G9 seemed too noisy at any reasonable ISO.
If someone put one on my desk today (and it is anywhere near as good a promised) I would just write out the cheque.
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Iloca
Unregistered at user's request
Reged: 06/12/2005
Posts: 3800
Loc: Northern Ireland
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Quote:
People upgrading from compacts apparently...
Upgrading to what? they're going to go for Micro 4/3rds rather than an entry level DSLR or a bridge? Why?
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I suspect that if the actual camera and lenses are sufficiently compact it may have rather more appeal to those who are looking for something G9 sized but with a bigger sensor.
Olympus need another niche product like I need a 3rd armpit. I though this was about mass market appeal.
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If the quality, features and operability of the cameras and lenses are up to scratch
It won't be, they had to opt for dual function buttons on the E-3 and it's big enough, they can't avoid using the rear LCD/menu on the E-520/420 how can they make it useable on something half the size of an E-420
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It'll be interesting to see how it sits alongside the normal 4/3rds.............
.............it may seriously erode the sales of normal 4/3rds - enough even to dangerously reduce the viability of the E system?...
Thats a very real danger and wouldn't it just cap the bottle, release a product to the mass market that turns out to be a niche product and ends up killing off your other niche? product alienating your most loyal users at the same time.
That would be classic even by Olympus standards. If it happens we'll call it the 'Triple Crown'
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Mi Vid Iloca
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alanS
Dr Dust
Reged: 30/09/2005
Posts: 3650
Loc: Up North, England.
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This has to be good news especially if it has a basic add on viewfinder of some sort. If it has an EVF I do hope it's usable.
One thing that I keep wondering is why Olympus don't offer a more conventional APS-C or better still a FF DSLR? I think that a range encompassing a conventional type FF DSLR and a compact option like 4:3 would be very attractive especially if they keep the mp count down and the build quality up for the more compact camera system.
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Alan's defence lawyer claimed that "Booze played no part in his typo's."
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Iloca
Unregistered at user's request
Reged: 06/12/2005
Posts: 3800
Loc: Northern Ireland
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Quote:
One thing that I keep wondering is why Olympus don't offer a more conventional APS-C or better still a FF DSLR?
I don't see what they have to gain by adopting an APS-C sensor. Full frame fair enough but even then there are sufficient full frame options already. Who is going to buy these hypothetical APS-C and Full Frame Olympus cameras? Nikon/Pentax/Canon/Sony users? why would they ditch their existing kit to switch to Olympus. Think Olympus E-System users would all want to switch format? it may not have occurred to you that people use the E-System because it suits their needs as is. I switched from APS-C Nikon to 4/3rds Olympus, if I was that desperate to own Full Frame or APS-C I'd switch to a brand that offered it, if the Olympus name was really important to me but I still wanted Full Frame I'd buy a D700 and paint Olympus on the Prism.
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Mi Vid Iloca
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alanS
Dr Dust
Reged: 30/09/2005
Posts: 3650
Loc: Up North, England.
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I'd imagine that there are lots of older Olympus lenses about. Will they fit 4:3?
My thinking was that Olympus film camera users might like a digital camera to mount their lenses on. If they'll fit 4:3 then there's possibly no need for an APS-C option but if they wont there's still a market for an Oly FF surely.
I'm just a visitor here, you Oly fans know best, what do you do with older Oly lenses? will they fit 4:3?
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Alan's defence lawyer claimed that "Booze played no part in his typo's."
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RogerMac
Hotshoe Shuffler
Reged: 25/03/2007
Posts: 497
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Quote:
I'm just a visitor here, you Oly fans know best, what do you do with older Oly lenses? will they fit 4:3?
Sometimes I also feel like a visitor as my film cameras were all Canon or Bronica, however OM lenses can be fitted to 4/3 via an adaptor. A recent firmware upgrade has allowed IS to be used with these lenses. I believe also that here is a Russian chipped adaptor (Dandylion?)that allows focus confirm.
As the flange to film plane distance is smaller than most SLRs adaptors are possible for many formats, unfortunately I have never found one for Canon FD lenses
Roger
Edited by RogerMac (06/08/2008 19:14)
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Iloca
Unregistered at user's request
Reged: 06/12/2005
Posts: 3800
Loc: Northern Ireland
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Quote:
I'd imagine that there are lots of older Olympus lenses about. Will they fit 4:3?
My thinking was that Olympus film camera users might like a digital camera to mount their lenses on. If they'll fit 4:3 then there's possibly no need for an APS-C option but if they wont there's still a market for an Oly FF surely.
I'm just a visitor here, you Oly fans know best, what do you do with older Oly lenses? will they fit 4:3?
Alan, first off I apologise for being snappy. Yes as Roger has said OM lenses work just fine via an adapter but the limitations are Stop down metering and manual focus (even with AF OM lenses which used a screw drive from the body) Regarding Full Frame from Olympus, I'm not convinced it's worth while if the only reason is to use OM lenses, I could buy a Canon 5D if thats what I wanted to do. Olympus would need to introduce a complete Full Frame system and in doing so would be aiming to compete head on with the two biggest names in the Industry, Canon and Nikon. As I said earlier even if there was a FF option from Olympus there would be little reason for Canon/Nikon users to change brands and little or no reason for Olympus users to adopt it if the only reason for doing so was to use OM lenses. That can be achieved already using the 5D and like I say there are the Nikon and Canon FF options available if you really need FF.
4/3rds has survived thus far as it clearly offers something different to APS-C/FF, something that E-System users clearly want in spite of the limitations, some have even come from APS-C models like myself. I feel that it's better for that choice to remain. Do we need another APS-C brand in addition to the 5 we already have?
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Iloca
Unregistered at user's request
Reged: 06/12/2005
Posts: 3800
Loc: Northern Ireland
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An interesting look at Micro 4/3rds.
Micro 4/3rds/Imaging Resource
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Mi Vid Iloca
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alanS
Dr Dust
Reged: 30/09/2005
Posts: 3650
Loc: Up North, England.
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There's no need to say sorry, no offence was taken.
I just thought that there might be room in the world for a dual line up from Olympus, one line of FF stuff and another more compact line.
I am genuinely interested in a quality compact system offering better quality than a small sensor compact. I have just bought a Panasonic LX2 but I'm sure there's room at home for something like a E420 with a 25mm lens.
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Alan's defence lawyer claimed that "Booze played no part in his typo's."
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RogerMac
Hotshoe Shuffler
Reged: 25/03/2007
Posts: 497
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If you want a new (far fetched) rumour here is one:
About a year ago and again last month there were rumours of an Oly with a "Triad" sensor - that's one with a beam splitter and three separate colour sensors, each with about 6Mp giving 18 in all and an individual pixel size that would allow vey high ISOs, and IQ equal or better than FF.
It seemed stupid at the time since the space taken by the sensor would clash with the mirror mechanism, however if EVF can be made to work there would easily be room in an E3 to put such a sensor.
Just a rumour
Roger
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Iloca
Unregistered at user's request
Reged: 06/12/2005
Posts: 3800
Loc: Northern Ireland
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Ok Alan thanks
I think the problem Olympus has at present is that while E-System users are happy with the E-System as a concept, they would like to see it evolve but everyone has his/her idea of what direction it should go. Granted the new concept is 'Micro 4/3rds' not 'Micro E-System' but as it uses the same sensor as the E-System and can use current E-System lenses (how will the AF work on the lenses that can't AF in Live View) it's difficult not to try to consider how it fits into the current range.
It's fairly common on Olympus forums to hear of people who have an E-3 but who've also bought the entry level E-410/420 due to it's compact size (it's something that I thought of doing myself) However they are aware of the limitations present in the E-410/420 and almost all say they want a camera that has the physical size of the 410/420 but with the direct access of the E-3, the build including weather sealing of the E-3 and the V/F and AF of the E-3 even it it means loosing the pop-up flash. I've not yet seen any who want a body smaller than the E-410/420 if it means having the same U/I or a U/I that is even more menu driven. The 3 key areas are V/F, U/I and AF and in that respect the Micro 4/3rds looks as if it will fail to deliver to current E-System users looking for a 'High Spec Compact' as it's likely to have a worse V/F than an E-410, slower AF than a DSLR and less direct controls.
I personally couldn't live with it, my main reason for buying a DSLR in the 1st place was because I'd to all intents and purposes never used anything apart from an SLR and couldn't get on with compacts either film or digital. Just shrink the E-3 and that'll do me. A compact is still a compact whether you can swap lenses or not and whether the sensor is bigger than other compacts or not (a Micro 4/3rds camera still has a smaller sensor than the Sigma DP-1 anyway) and as such it'll have all the other faults that compacts are burdened with.
With that said I could find myself evangelising on the benefits of 'Micro 4/3rds' this time next year.
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Mi Vid Iloca
My Flickr Gallery
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Iloca
Unregistered at user's request
Reged: 06/12/2005
Posts: 3800
Loc: Northern Ireland
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Quote:
If you want a new (far fetched) rumour here is one:
About a year ago and again last month there were rumours of an Oly with a "Triad" sensor - that's one with a beam splitter and three separate colour sensors, each with about 6Mp giving 18 in all and an individual pixel size that would allow vey high ISOs, and IQ equal or better than FF.
It seemed stupid at the time since the space taken by the sensor would clash with the mirror mechanism, however if EVF can be made to work there would easily be room in an E3 to put such a sensor.
Just a rumour
Roger
It's a good one though
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Mi Vid Iloca
My Flickr Gallery
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Benchista
Wich Tyler
Reged: 11/08/2000
Posts: 37849
Loc: Everywhere and nowhere, baby
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Quote:
An interesting look at Micro 4/3rds.
Micro 4/3rds/Imaging Resource
Yes, that seems to be a pretty accurate assessment.
Thing is that for me, a Micro 4/3 camera isn't for a minute a replacement for my main DSLR, but it fills a gap that no other digital camera can do currently - effectively what a film rangefinder did, and a fairly compact one at that - think Leica CL. This week's AP review of the Ricoh GX200 shows that even the best of compacts just can't do that job properly. Now I've long argued that the 4/3 system simply can't compete head on on quality against the larger sensors, although it's capable of a very decent level of quality. Where it can beat larger sensors hands down is in enabling smaller cameras and lenses. Micro 4/3 appears to be a tacit acceptance of that, and a shifting of the battle to where Olysonic actually can win. Is it a niche? Possibly, but I suspect it's a much bigger niche than the existing 4/3 market, TBH - after all, competition isn't getting any easier in the main DSLR market.Further there should be a pretty competitive price - take out the cost of a reflex viewing system and price could be very interesting.
The big question of course is what it means for the existing 4/3 system, and I don't think there's any way of answering that right now.
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Nick
www.nbrphoto.com
Light and Shade II - the new blog
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