robgodd
newbie
Reged: 22/01/2008
Posts: 14
Loc: Stourbridge, West Mids.
|
|
Hi all,
I was hoping to have Module 2 done by now, but the restriction of needing to put the camera in auto mode is limiting what I can do. Because I can't control the aperture, I can't set the small value I need to create the picture I want (i.e. a wide depth of field).
I know the task is about assessing exposure, but are allowances made for the fact that I can't get the picture I would otherwise be able to get in AP mode? Please don't say that I need to select a different subject - it's taken me ages to find the one I've got!
Anyone else had similar problems?
Cheers,
Rob
|
GDN
old hand
Reged: 05/02/2008
Posts: 719
Loc: Surrey
|
|
Hi Rob,
I can understand where you are coming from. I had the same issue with my photos, I just wanted more depth of field but on fully auto mode it defaults to the widest aperture (narrow depth of field).
Can you change apertures on your aperture ring on your lens or is it a fully digital lens? If you change the aperture ring and still shot on auto it should be ok? Try it and check the exif information on the image.
Hope this helps
Gary
--------------------
Gary - My Flickr Site
|
robgodd
newbie
Reged: 22/01/2008
Posts: 14
Loc: Stourbridge, West Mids.
|
|
Hi Gary,
Yes, it's a digital lens, so no aperture ring (its a new camera, though - my first DSLR, and I'm loving it!)
Still, I think I'll recompose things a bit to make use of the narrow DOF. I've had some more ideas....
Rob
|
Matt_Hunt
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 07/11/2005
Posts: 2255
|
|
Hi
I am confused as to why you cannot change aperture. since I am on a slighty different course (The diploma in Photography) I am not 100% sure about the module  but if you are meant to be using 'P' mode, the camera ought to allow you to switch through various options for correct exposure any way.
e.g. 1/125 and f8, 1/60 and f11 or 1/500 and f5.6.
What does the course book want you do for this section?
Also, many full frame lenses have no aperture ring, lack of an aperture ring is not an indicator of being a lens for a DSLR.
--------------------
http://www.flickr.com/photos/reactivefilm/
|
GDN
old hand
Reged: 05/02/2008
Posts: 719
Loc: Surrey
|
|
Quote:
Hi
I am confused as to why you cannot change aperture. since I am on a slighty different course (The diploma in Photography) I am not 100% sure about the module but if you are meant to be using 'P' mode, the camera ought to allow you to switch through various options for correct exposure any way.
Hi Matt,
The initial excercise states:
Quote:
Find three objects; one black, one white and one grey. Using your camera in Auto or Program mode take a picture of each, ensuring that you completely fill the frame with the object. If you don’t have Auto or Program mode simply use the camera’s suggested settings in Manual mode.
If I shoot on Auto mode my camera choses everything for me. In 'P' mode if I change aperture then it shows as aperture priority mode on the photographs EXIF. Luckly on some of my lenses I can change the aperture on the aperture ring, so I could change it that way.
--------------------
Gary - My Flickr Site
|
Matt_Hunt
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 07/11/2005
Posts: 2255
|
|
Hi Gary
OK, so essentially the exercise is showing that the metered reading will tend to overexpose blacks and underexpose whites because the meter uses c.18% gray as the reference point for exposure? i.e. the black and white image will both look gray?
Its rather dark now but I'll shoot it tomorrow am on Aperture priority, shutter priority, manual and program and see what the difference is (am intrigued) because I am clearly missing the point about aperture from the origional post unless Rob has found a scene of one of those three colours with 3D feature.
(Am starting to worry I am missing the point here but am wondering if Rob is putting himself to more stress than he needs to!)
What happens if you alter shutter speed in Program mode? surely then the camera will automatically adjust the aperture to bring the exposure back to the metered value? The exif data might change, but since Program mode allows you to alter shutter / aperture settings, then regardless of what the exif data says, you did what the course asked and the end result is the same (?) - an image exposed correctly for the camera's meter reading?
--------------------
http://www.flickr.com/photos/reactivefilm/
|
robgodd
newbie
Reged: 22/01/2008
Posts: 14
Loc: Stourbridge, West Mids.
|
|
Hi,
You're quite right, Gary. Like I said, my new E510 is my first DSLR, and I'm still learning to use it! I didn't realise that P mode allowed me to alter the aperture whilst keeping everything else effectively in auto mode - I just went straight to auto mode. To be honest, I don't think I've ever used P mode on any camera; I usually stick to aperture or shutter priority.
Oh well, another lesson learned. Thanks for everyone's input into was was quite an elementary mistake after all.
Rob
|
Matt_Hunt
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 07/11/2005
Posts: 2255
|
|
Cool
so, what are the 3 subjects?
For interest I've just tried the black, gray, white thing and got this:
Black card
Gray card
White card
Poor confused light meter.....
--------------------
http://www.flickr.com/photos/reactivefilm/
|
FatherPie
journeyman
Reged: 18/04/2008
Posts: 91
Loc: West Yorkshire
|
|
Quote:
Poor confused light meter.....
I know what you mean. Mod 2 of my course uses a grey card test to teach us the latitude of our camera sensors (+3 to -4 EV for mine a total of 7 stops). In doing so I also found that my 40D typically underexposes by around 1/3rd stop at ISO100. Useful exercise though and really helped me understand how to get the best out of the camera/sensor.
As a newcomer I've been really impressed by those of you that regularly try to help others - keeps me coming back every day!
Regards
--------------------
Dave
www.whenham.net
|
GDN
old hand
Reged: 05/02/2008
Posts: 719
Loc: Surrey
|
|
Quote:
OK, so essentially the exercise is showing that the metered reading will tend to overexpose blacks and underexpose whites because the meter uses c.18% gray as the reference point for exposure? i.e. the black and white image will both look gray?
Yes Matt. Thats the reason for the exercise. Its a metering exercise to show you how your camera reacts to black and white objects.
I tried to stay away from altering settings as it does say Auto or P mode, which if I altered the shutter speed or aperture would show as aperture or shutter priority on the image (I know it won't make the slightest bit of difference with regards to the metering but it does state only those modes).
Quote:
....am wondering if Rob is putting himself to more stress than he needs to!
I think maybe Rob is. Hopefully he's now a little less stressed out and has a way forward. 
--------------------
Gary - My Flickr Site
|
Matt_Hunt
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 07/11/2005
Posts: 2255
|
|
And now for something completey different....
I am off to the tip!
--------------------
http://www.flickr.com/photos/reactivefilm/
|
Garry McNamara
Snr Tutor/Bongo Banjo
Reged: 16/08/2006
Posts: 2079
|
|
Quote:
Find three objects; one black, one white and one grey. Using your camera in Auto or Program mode take a picture of each, ensuring that you completely fill the frame with the object. If you don’t have Auto or Program mode simply use the camera’s suggested settings in Manual mode .
The original suggestion of using program mode is to keep the camera in control, making the task easier and more consistant. The aim of course is to emphasises thorough the lens metering's big drawback if you allow the camera to make decisions about exposure for you.
It does leave the option to work in maunual mode (promise not to check your camera model against your exif data - that would just be nit picking!) allowing you to select your aperture or shutter speed of choice.
Text book examples Matt - shocking isn't it, but reasuring - we are still cleverer than the machines!
Garry
|
Matt_Hunt
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 07/11/2005
Posts: 2255
|
|
Hi Garry
Whilst I knew what the results should be, I was suprised to see exactly hot similar the results where. I was wondering I'd be asked if I posted the same frame cropped and rotated differently!
--------------------
http://www.flickr.com/photos/reactivefilm/
Edited by Matt_Hunt (12/05/2008 10:36)
|
Paul_M
newbie
Reged: 25/03/2008
Posts: 20
|
|
If I can add my 2p here. I'm not sure what other cameras do, but Nikons have a P mode in addition to auto. In 'P' the camera is still choosing the exposure, but it allows you to scroll through the various options e.g. 1/125 at f/11 is the same as 1/1000 at f/4 (assuming I've done my sums correctly) I assume this would still be allowed as you're going with the camera's settings, but it allows you to control DoF.
One quick question of my own now, my black object is quite shiny and has a couple of bright spots on it due to reflections from the window. Is this acceptable, or does it need to be totally black?
Cheers
Paul
--------------------
Please read the forum guidelines RE reciprocal links before adding URLs here. Thank you. Admin.
|
Garry McNamara
Snr Tutor/Bongo Banjo
Reged: 16/08/2006
Posts: 2079
|
|
Even then the camera is still controlling exposure level - how it achieves that in terms of combination of aperture and shutter speed could be varied but the meter would still be deciding the amount of light used to make the exposure - unlike in manual mode where you could very easily choose to under or over expose by over riding the meter. The idea is to make the exercise easy by reducing user input.
Yes a black, grey or white object with significant shadow or highlight areas would mean the results would be skewed - even then if you explain that in your assessment it will demonstrate your understanding of how a meter simply measures light and does not have any intelligent understanding of what the subject actually is.
|
LizzieD60
newbie
Reged: 18/08/2008
Posts: 13
Loc: Bedford
|
|
I am having problems with the grey card!!!
|
Matt_Hunt
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 07/11/2005
Posts: 2255
|
|
What are you trying to do with it?
--------------------
http://www.flickr.com/photos/reactivefilm/
|
Previous
Index
Next
Threaded
Edit
Reply
Quote
